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Re: ABS/Lloyds certification

Hi, Vance:
        Actually, our experience with ABS/Lloyds has been the opposite of
your speculation; Lloyd's favor test - ABS favor paper. Though, having said
that, it is quite evident that ABS is making a strong effort to 'get with
the program' and relax some of the overly stringent rules (that have been
around since day one)  in  the light of several decades of field
experience. For example: I am on the ABS submersible commitee and, although
I was not able to attend the last meeting, the minutes and my discussions
with some of the other members indicate that the ' x years of service'
change-out requirement for acrylic view-ports has been considerably 
extended. This was brought about by intense lobbying from the large tourist
sub operators . .who could be facing a quarter of a mil (per sub) to change
all ports at once. The original concern was the lack of data on  cyclic
stress, UV damage, etc. Even though Jerry Stachiw told them 20 years ago
that they were being too stiff, they elected to err on the side of caution.
Now, of course, the historic data is to hand. Caused a lot of guys like
myself no end of hassle -' Deep Rover'  is officially registered as having
an '18 inch long' hull!  The acrylic hemis are considered to be viewports!
Well, to change those 'viewports' cost a hundred grand plus!  We have
already changed them once!
        As far as Agency certification costs:  - about the same. Very
different methodolgy, though, so the actual costs could vary considerably,
depending on your existent in-house capability.( Engineers, own
pressure-test facility, etc.)  Not cheap, though . . .I suggest that the
psubbers who say they plan to 'get ABS'  need to closely study the initial
requirements and then the periodic cost of keeping the boat in class. It
depends entirely on what you plan to use the sub for . . .own use - sell to
others - lease services with your crew - lease bare-boat, etc.  insurance
MUCH more dificult/costly on unclassed boat.

Regards
Phil Nuytten

P.S. I'm gonna go out on the NASA space-shuttle booster recovery demo with
DeepWorker. Will be in the Cape 22nd thru' 25th this month - will give you
a shout