[PSUBS-MAILIST] pressure test
MerlinSub at t-online.de
Thu Oct 24 14:32:00 EDT 2013
Building a own chamber is also a cheap way - use material from scrapp.
Fill them complete with water and press her with a 1.5 saftey faktor
before first sub use.
Can be below 1000 USD for the material.
Reinhard in Berlin did that way. Everthing made from second hand
material.
And many friends with Psubs comes over the years for a day or a weekend
to make there test there.
http://www.euronaut.org/content/gfx/old_projects/IMG_6099a.jpg
http://www.euronaut.org/content/gfx/old_projects/IMG_6098a.jpg
http://www.euronaut.org/content/gfx/old_projects/IMG_6100a.jpg
The pressure will be done by a simple small highpressure water cleaner..
The only contra on a bolted hatch is that it takes hours to close and to
open.
A lake or pool with the water and a pump in helps a lot.
vbr Carsten
" " <MerlinSub at t-online.de> schrieb:
Look for a company which impregnate wood under pressure.
The pressure boiler have the right size and the pressure is good for
around 300 feet.
Normaly they are relative unexpensive - around 500 USD. Some of them are
good for 500 feet.
We did it here in the past and today - works. But all meassuring and
sensors up to yourself.
Nothing you can use official.
http://www.petermueller.be/joinery-impregnation/impregnation/#
http://cdn.agrarverlag.at/to/mmedia/image//2013.04.22/1366647313692_1.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Industrial_Autoclaves.jpg
Or looking around for industrial autoclaves.
Glas companies have them in that size to make saftey glases
And Aircraft companies working with grp/crp technic.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/81/Autoclave_Laminacion_de_Vidrio.jpg
Or buy you own, make the test and sale it again with a big win.. ;-)
http://www.thermalequipment.com/used-inv2.html
A profesional chamber for dive equipment in Scotland
ask f or a simple pressure test witth not so much sensors around 9 K
USD.
And there are 3000 feet are no problem.
I ask our navy for there Submarine pressure dock some 20 years ago
Answer was 70.000 USD for the test and additional the same amount for
the dock insurance company..
http://file1.npage.de/006622/23/bilder/715_dockc_04.jpg
http://file1.npage.de/006622/23/bilder/715_dockc_02.jpg
http://file1.npage.de/006622/23/bilder/715_dockc_03.jpg
http://file1.npage.de/006622/23/bilder/715_dockc_01.jpg
vbr Carsten
<JimToddPsub at aol.com> schrieb:
Joe,
The cost of pressure testing has as much to do with multi-point
measuring and analysis of distortion as it does with just seeing if the
vessel can survive a given depth intact. There is a depth [above crush
depth] at which the vessel undergoes enough stress that one cycle or
repeated cycles can compromise the vessel even though it might not
appear to have suffered. Vance and others can speak a lot more to that
than I can.
Jim
In a message dated 10/23/2013 8:46:44 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
josephperkel at yahoo.com writes:
Wow that's a bit rough for a working man! So much for that.
I must say though, that I don't like much the lower the sub to the
bottom and hope it comes back method of deep testing.
Joe
Sent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad
From: Alec Smyth <alecsmyth at gmail.com>;
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org>;
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] pressure test
Sent: Wed, Oct 23, 2013 12:52:33 PM
Hi Hank,
I asked at Carderock over a decade ago and was told the cost would
depend on setup time, which varies depending on how much instrumentation
you want during the test, but that a typical figure was around $27K.
Waaaay beyond my budget. Dale Heinzing tested Snoopy somewhere on the
West side of Canada at a lumber yard. Snoopy went in the tank alongside
the lumber and must have been pretty well disinfected, but the scary bit
was that they released the pressure almost instantaneously, with a bang.
That test was to only 400' so not really sufficient for a Nekton, but
it might still be of interest since I think it's relatively close to you
and probably was inexpensive.
Best,
Alec
On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 8:33 AM, Joe Perkel <josephperkel at yahoo.com>
wrote:
Hank,
There are two in the states however, the one on the west coast has a 72"
limit if I recall correctly.
The other on the east coast, is the same one used for the k-600 and
Alvin.
A contract and waiver are required, let us know the cost if you do it.
Go to the WHOI website for info
Joe
From: hank pronk <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 23, 2013 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] pressure test
Does anyone know if the is a pressure chamber large enough to test my
Nekton submarine in the Pacific North West.
Hank
From: Phil Nuytten <phil at philnuytten.com>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2013 10:19:38 PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Best Steel to use for Sub Hull
Hi, Hugh
As Vance says, HY80 is somewhat challenging to weld err, actually,
thats an understatement. We had to work with our fabricators to come up
with a whole weld procedure to satisfy our classing agency. If you
decide to go this route, let me know and we will share that procedure.
Phil
From: vbra676539 at aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2013 7:18 PM
To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Best Steel to use for Sub Hull
I think it is somewhat demanding to weld, and expensive by comparison,
of course. That said, there is a mountain of data available, as the
pressure hulls of most modern US Navy submarines are built out of it.
Vance
-----Original Message-----
From: Hugh Fulton <hc.fulton at gmail.com>
To: 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Tue, Oct 22, 2013 10:15 pm
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Best Steel to use for Sub Hull
Vance, Yep that sounds about right.
Are there any nasties to using it?
Chs Hugh
From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org?] On Behalf Of Vance
Bradley
Sent: Wednesday, 23 October 2013 1:37 p.m.
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Best Steel to use for Sub Hull
Hugh,
HY-80 used to maintain the standard dimensions of a DW2000 with 50%
depth increase.
Vance
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 22, 2013, at 8:13 PM, "Hugh Fulton" <hc.fulton at gmail.com> wrote:
Vance, I am sure I saw recently from Phil that he was using HY 80 but I
dont know what on. I did a calc on mine and I got a lot deeper using
the HY 80 specs over the Grade 70.
Hugh
From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of
vbra676539 at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, 23 October 2013 11:55 a.m.
To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Best Steel to use for Sub Hull
One other thing comes to mind on this. Phil uses A516Gr70 in the
DW2000s. It occurs to me that if there was a demonstrable benefit to
A537, he would have used taken advantage of it. And he didn't,
apparently. Interesting. Don't know why, though. Maybe it has something
to do with welding stainless inserts in and the heat treatment thereof.
Just a guess.
Vance
-----Original Message-----
From: JimToddPsub <JimToddPsub at aol.com>
To: personal_submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Tue, Oct 22, 2013 6:42 pm
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Best Steel to use for Sub Hull
Vance,
>From Leeco Steel's website:
A537 plate steel is heat-treated. As a result, it displays greater yield
and tensile strength than the more standard A516 grades. A537 steel
plate is ideal for both in boilers and pressure vessels, and is used in
the oil, gas and petrochemical industry.
Nice to see it provides at least a brief comparison to A516. I'm sure
there are more variables to consider including cost.
Jim
In a message dated 10/22/2013 5:23:43 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
vbra676539 at aol.com writes:
Jim,
A537 was used extensively, as well, especially in the early boats that
Perry built. Maybe you can figure it out. It seems that I recall being
told that it was somewhat harder to weld but had better
cold-water-under-pressure properties. Maybe Dr. Nuytten would weigh in
on this, assuming he isn't up to his ass in DW3000 alligators this week
(which I suspect he is).
Vance
-----Original Message-----
From: JimToddPsub <JimToddPsub at aol.com>
To: personal_submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Tue, Oct 22, 2013 4:18 pm
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Best Steel to use for Sub Hull
Greg,
I should have clarified that. It was a cut-and-paste from a web site.
I'm more of a librarian in that I save info in an organized fashion when
I come across it so I'll have it available later when the need arises.
That was the case in this instance.
Jim
In a message dated 10/22/2013 1:25:34 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
jgcottrell2002 at yahoo.com writes:
Thanks for the info, Jim. It's good to know there is some one in the
group that is also in the steel industry.
Greg
From: "JimToddPsub at aol.com" <JimToddPsub at aol.com>
To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2013 12:59 PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Best Steel to use for Sub Hull
Maybe more detail than you really want to know, but here goes:
ASTM A 516 or ASME SA 516 grade is one of the most popular steel grades
in market .
It is primarily intended for use in welded pressure vessels where notch
toughness is important. It comes in four grades 55, 60, 65 & 70. At
Oakley Steel we mainly sell 516 gr 60 and 516 gr 70. These grades cover
a range of tensile strengths from 55 - 90 MPa and this versatility
explains much of the specifications popularity.
For plates thinner than 40mm we normally supply them as rolled. Plates
supplied above 40mm thick are normalised.
For A 516 grade 70, which is one of our most popular steels, the ASME
standard composition is as follows (dependent on grade):
Carbon 0.27 - 0.31%
Manganese 0.79 - 1.3%
Phosphorous 0.035% max
Sulphur 0.035% max
Silicon 0.13 - 0.45%
In a message dated 10/22/2013 11:53:12 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
jonw at psubs.org writes:
Generally, A516gr70 suffices for personal or recreational submarines.
Jon
On 10/22/2013 12:45 PM, Christopher Cave wrote:
Hello,
What is the best steel to use for a submarine hull. Someone mentioned
marine steel such as 316,316L or 317. Any suggestions or a website I can
review.
Thanks,
Chris
Christopher Cave
christophercave at yahoo.com
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0172 8464 420
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