From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Feb 1 21:18:27 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2015 20:18:27 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Message-ID: I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 01:50:10 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 06:50:10 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <820010482.450297.1422859810649.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Scott,the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by thisNorth America company...http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco.The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual.There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about;lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense thanlithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acidper kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of yearswhen I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that willbe fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphurin them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithiumbattery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air.Alan? ? From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 06:51:18 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 05:51:18 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Message-ID: Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine to keep the weight down. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Scott, the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by this North America company... http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco. The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual. There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about; lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense than lithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acid per kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of years when I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that will be fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphur in them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithium battery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air. Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 11:06:31 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 16:06:31 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector Message-ID: Hi All, Could someone please do me a favour? I have the BH4F low power bulkhead connector fitted to my boat. Its running the transducer for the underwater comms. The other day I was moving the boat with trolley jacks and I think I may have hit the bulkhead connector as I jacked it up. The connector is fitted together with the male part and the 2 red retaining caps are screwed together. If I take the clips apart, and wiggle the two connectors, they feel "rubbery". Trouble is im not sure if it was like this before or if its been damaged. The radio still works ok and separating the connector shows no sign of damage, but im not 100% sure I still haven't damaged something inside the connector. I've just got the feeling something is broken inside and its now just touching together to make the connection. Can someone with this type of connector on their boat, unscrew the red retaining caps and let me know if the assembly feels a bit rubbery, or if its solid? Thanks in advance! James ? ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: BH4F.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 43661 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 11:38:04 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 08:38:04 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1422895084.54629.YahooMailNeo@web181205.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> James, I have this bulkhead connector on my boat. I went out to my shop and did the wiggle test. Yes it feel rubbery so I think there is good chance that no damage was done. Cliff ________________________________ From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: "personal_submersibles at psubs.org" Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 10:06 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector Hi All, Could someone please do me a favour? I have the BH4F low power bulkhead connector fitted to my boat. Its running the transducer for the underwater comms. The other day I was moving the boat with trolley jacks and I think I may have hit the bulkhead connector as I jacked it up. The connector is fitted together with the male part and the 2 red retaining caps are screwed together. If I take the clips apart, and wiggle the two connectors, they feel "rubbery". Trouble is im not sure if it was like this before or if its been damaged. The radio still works ok and separating the connector shows no sign of damage, but im not 100% sure I still haven't damaged something inside the connector. I've just got the feeling something is broken inside and its now just touching together to make the connection. Can someone with this type of connector on their boat, unscrew the red retaining caps and let me know if the assembly feels a bit rubbery, or if its solid? Thanks in advance! James ? ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: BH4F.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 43661 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 11:59:56 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 16:59:56 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector In-Reply-To: <1422895084.54629.YahooMailNeo@web181205.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1422895084.54629.YahooMailNeo@web181205.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Cliff, Great! Many thanks for that. I'm relieved. Regards James On 2 February 2015 at 16:38, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > James, I have this bulkhead connector on my boat. I went out to my shop > and did the wiggle test. Yes it feel rubbery so I think there is good > chance that no damage was done. > > Cliff > > > > > > *From:* James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *To:* "personal_submersibles at psubs.org" > *Sent:* Monday, February 2, 2015 10:06 AM > *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector > > Hi All, > Could someone please do me a favour? > > I have the BH4F low power bulkhead connector fitted to my boat. Its > running the transducer for the underwater comms. > > The other day I was moving the boat with trolley jacks and I think I may > have hit the bulkhead connector as I jacked it up. > > The connector is fitted together with the male part and the 2 red > retaining caps are screwed together. If I take the clips apart, and wiggle > the two connectors, they feel "rubbery". Trouble is im not sure if it was > like this before or if its been damaged. > > The radio still works ok and separating the connector shows no sign of > damage, but im not 100% sure I still haven't damaged something inside the > connector. I've just got the feeling something is broken inside and its > now just touching together to make the connection. > > Can someone with this type of connector on their boat, unscrew the red > retaining caps and let me know if the assembly feels a bit rubbery, or if > its solid? > > Thanks in advance! > James > > > > ? > ? > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: BH4F.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 43661 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 13:32:00 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 18:32:00 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <485559805.626331.1422901920478.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Iam not sure about that battery Scott,but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module.SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group | ? | | ? | | ? | ? | ? | ? | ? | | SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Ele...SWE SeaSafe Autonomous, Smart Lithium-Ion Battery Modules | | | | View on www.swe.com | Preview by Yahoo | | | | ? | ? I couldn't remember their name, then looked at the T shirt they gave me?at the last underwater intervention convention:)They will possibly be in New Orleans for this February's U. I. convention.There is an exhibitor list.Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 12:51 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine to keep the weight down.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Scott,the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by thisNorth America company...http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco.The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual.There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about;lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense thanlithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acidper kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of yearswhen I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that willbe fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphurin them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithiumbattery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air.Alan? ? From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 13:45:48 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (glen brown via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 20:45:48 +0200 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector In-Reply-To: References: <1422895084.54629.YahooMailNeo@web181205.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Does anyone know the max depth a k350 has ever been tested to. Thanks Glen On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:59 PM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi Cliff, > > Great! Many thanks for that. I'm relieved. > > Regards > James > > On 2 February 2015 at 16:38, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> James, I have this bulkhead connector on my boat. I went out to my shop >> and did the wiggle test. Yes it feel rubbery so I think there is good >> chance that no damage was done. >> >> Cliff >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >> *To:* "personal_submersibles at psubs.org" >> >> *Sent:* Monday, February 2, 2015 10:06 AM >> *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector >> >> Hi All, >> Could someone please do me a favour? >> >> I have the BH4F low power bulkhead connector fitted to my boat. Its >> running the transducer for the underwater comms. >> >> The other day I was moving the boat with trolley jacks and I think I may >> have hit the bulkhead connector as I jacked it up. >> >> The connector is fitted together with the male part and the 2 red >> retaining caps are screwed together. If I take the clips apart, and wiggle >> the two connectors, they feel "rubbery". Trouble is im not sure if it was >> like this before or if its been damaged. >> >> The radio still works ok and separating the connector shows no sign of >> damage, but im not 100% sure I still haven't damaged something inside the >> connector. I've just got the feeling something is broken inside and its >> now just touching together to make the connection. >> >> Can someone with this type of connector on their boat, unscrew the red >> retaining caps and let me know if the assembly feels a bit rubbery, or if >> its solid? >> >> Thanks in advance! >> James >> >> >> >> ? >> ? >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: BH4F.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 43661 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 13:55:26 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 18:55:26 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <28658890.647804.1422903326441.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Haven't heard from you for a while Glen.Have you completed your K350?I think you were going well then moved to?the West Coast (S.A.)Alan From: glen brown via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 7:45 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector HiDoes anyone know the max depth a k350 has ever been tested to. ThanksGlen On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:59 PM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Cliff,?Great!? Many thanks for that.? I'm relieved.?RegardsJames On 2 February 2015 at 16:38, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James, I have this bulkhead connector on my boat.? I went out to my shop and did the wiggle test.? Yes it feel rubbery so I think there is good chance that no damage was done. Cliff From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: "personal_submersibles at psubs.org" Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 10:06 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector Hi All,Could someone please do me a favour??I have the BH4F low power bulkhead connector fitted to my boat.? Its running the transducer for the underwater comms.? ?The other day I was moving the boat with trolley jacks and I think I may have hit the bulkhead connector as I jacked it up.? ?The connector is fitted together with the male part and the 2 red retaining caps?are screwed together.? If I take the clips apart, and wiggle the two connectors, they feel "rubbery".? Trouble is im not sure if it was like this before or if its been damaged.? ?The radio still works ok and separating the connector shows no sign of damage, but im not 100% sure I still haven't damaged something inside the connector.? I've just got the feeling something is broken inside and its now just touching together to make the connection.?Can someone with this type of connector on their boat, unscrew the red retaining caps and let me know?if the assembly feels a bit rubbery, or if its solid??Thanks in advance!James?? ? ??? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 14:13:31 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 19:13:31 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector In-Reply-To: <28658890.647804.1422903326441.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <28658890.647804.1422903326441.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1834889389.650874.1422904411569.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Correction East Coast. From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 7:55 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector Haven't heard from you for a while Glen.Have you completed your K350?I think you were going well then moved to?the West Coast (S.A.)Alan From: glen brown via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 7:45 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector HiDoes anyone know the max depth a k350 has ever been tested to. ThanksGlen On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:59 PM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Cliff,?Great!? Many thanks for that.? I'm relieved.?RegardsJames On 2 February 2015 at 16:38, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James, I have this bulkhead connector on my boat.? I went out to my shop and did the wiggle test.? Yes it feel rubbery so I think there is good chance that no damage was done. Cliff From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: "personal_submersibles at psubs.org" Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 10:06 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector Hi All,Could someone please do me a favour??I have the BH4F low power bulkhead connector fitted to my boat.? Its running the transducer for the underwater comms.? ?The other day I was moving the boat with trolley jacks and I think I may have hit the bulkhead connector as I jacked it up.? ?The connector is fitted together with the male part and the 2 red retaining caps?are screwed together.? If I take the clips apart, and wiggle the two connectors, they feel "rubbery".? Trouble is im not sure if it was like this before or if its been damaged.? ?The radio still works ok and separating the connector shows no sign of damage, but im not 100% sure I still haven't damaged something inside the connector.? I've just got the feeling something is broken inside and its now just touching together to make the connection.?Can someone with this type of connector on their boat, unscrew the red retaining caps and let me know?if the assembly feels a bit rubbery, or if its solid??Thanks in advance!James?? ? ??? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 14:21:37 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 19:21:37 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: <485559805.626331.1422901920478.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <485559805.626331.1422901920478.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <172755401.645257.1422904897325.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Scott,there was talk of these batteries being used on Alvin.Not sure if it is happening but here is an article that mentions it. Sea Technology Magazine - Worldwide Information Leader for Marine Business, Science and Engineering | ? | | ? | | ? | ? | ? | ? | ? | | Sea Technology Magazine - Worldwide Information Leade...SEA TECHNOLOGY MAGAZINE WORLDWIDE INFORMATION LEADER FOR MARINE BUSINESS SCIENCE AND ENGENEERING | | | | View on www.sea-technology.com | Preview by Yahoo | | | | ? | ? Alan From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 7:32 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott,but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module.SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group | ? | | ? | | ? | ? | ? | ? | ? | | SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Ele...SWE SeaSafe Autonomous, Smart Lithium-Ion Battery Modules | | | | View on www.swe.com | Preview by Yahoo | | | | ? | ? I couldn't remember their name, then looked at the T shirt they gave me?at the last underwater intervention convention:)They will possibly be in New Orleans for this February's U. I. convention.There is an exhibitor list.Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 12:51 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine to keep the weight down.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Scott,the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by thisNorth America company...http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco.The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual.There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about;lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense thanlithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acidper kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of yearswhen I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that willbe fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphurin them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithiumbattery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air.Alan? ? From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 14:42:37 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 14:42:37 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector In-Reply-To: References: <1422895084.54629.YahooMailNeo@web181205.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Don't know about the "ever" part, but as I understand it Kittredge tested all his subs in a spot that is 500' deep. Best, Alec On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 1:45 PM, glen brown via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi > Does anyone know the max depth a k350 has ever been tested to. > > Thanks > Glen > > On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:59 PM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > >> Hi Cliff, >> >> Great! Many thanks for that. I'm relieved. >> >> Regards >> James >> >> On 2 February 2015 at 16:38, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >>> James, I have this bulkhead connector on my boat. I went out to my shop >>> and did the wiggle test. Yes it feel rubbery so I think there is good >>> chance that no damage was done. >>> >>> Cliff >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>> *To:* "personal_submersibles at psubs.org" >>> >>> *Sent:* Monday, February 2, 2015 10:06 AM >>> *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector >>> >>> Hi All, >>> Could someone please do me a favour? >>> >>> I have the BH4F low power bulkhead connector fitted to my boat. Its >>> running the transducer for the underwater comms. >>> >>> The other day I was moving the boat with trolley jacks and I think I may >>> have hit the bulkhead connector as I jacked it up. >>> >>> The connector is fitted together with the male part and the 2 red >>> retaining caps are screwed together. If I take the clips apart, and wiggle >>> the two connectors, they feel "rubbery". Trouble is im not sure if it was >>> like this before or if its been damaged. >>> >>> The radio still works ok and separating the connector shows no sign of >>> damage, but im not 100% sure I still haven't damaged something inside the >>> connector. I've just got the feeling something is broken inside and its >>> now just touching together to make the connection. >>> >>> Can someone with this type of connector on their boat, unscrew the red >>> retaining caps and let me know if the assembly feels a bit rubbery, or if >>> its solid? >>> >>> Thanks in advance! >>> James >>> >>> >>> >>> ? >>> ? >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: BH4F.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 43661 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 14:51:24 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 14:51:24 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Surface support Message-ID: Anyone looking for a cool surface support boat? This one cost $15M to build and is going for $180K. Probably takes that much to fill the tank, but you'll get to the dive spot in about 30 seconds... http://www.engadget.com/2015/02/02/wanna-buy-a-boat/ Much better appreciated in this other photo... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_Slice#mediaviewer/File:USN_experimental_Small_water_area_vessel.jpg Best, Alec -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 15:55:27 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (=?UTF-8?Q?Andr=C3=A9_Eriksen?= via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 21:55:27 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub In-Reply-To: <1422711784.30543.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1422711784.30543.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thank you for the input Alec. I got a quote some time ago on the hemispheres.. around 1800 USD for the both. Have had the concern of distorted visibility with the acrylic dome, but thought it would be allright since I never have heard complaints on it. I might look into going with a taller tower and flat viewports. More freeboard and better visibility quality is not a bad thing. My center of gravity and bouyancy calculations show I have some flexibilty there. Andr? 2015-01-31 14:43 GMT+01:00 hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org>: > Andre, > I have a sub with an acrylic cylinder for the CT and the visibility is > fantastic, > Hank > -------------------------------------------- > On Fri, 1/30/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Received: Friday, January 30, 2015, 10:27 PM > > Hi > Andre, > Very nice drawing and > concept, I like the simplicity and it looks balanced. I > would have the following observations: > - Check that you can actually get > those hemispherical heads for a reasonable price. > Hemispherical heads are far less common than elliptical. I > was once shopping for endcaps and got the following quote: > "The elliptical is $300, the hemispherical is $300 plus > $4000 in tooling setup costs". > - Regarding the coning tower design > (K250 in this case) it depends what you want the sub for. > The problem with that tower is the low freeboard, which is > fine for lakes but insufficient for open water. You cannot > open a K250 hatch in the ocean in anything but flat calm > conditions. Also, visibility out of a K250 dome hatch is not > good, even though that might sound counter-intuitive. You > are looking through the side of a dome, which means poor > optics. The bow dome visibility will be wonderful, because > you're looking through the apex. Or, of course, > visibility of the surface will be good from the > coning tower, but one only uses that upon > surfacing. > - I would > not worry too much about the boat being top heavy. In > general, between low drop weights, low batteries, and high > MBTs these little boats are extremely stable. You should be > able to carry a significantly taller tower than that one > given the hull beneath it. I'm not saying you should > skip the stability calculations, I'm just saying I think > you will find that the calculations prove you can carry a > higher tower that will allow for flat viewports and increase > freeboard. Another option is to put a cylindrical viewport > on the K250 tower to bump it up. I haven't done that > myself, but it could be done. > Best, > Alec > On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at > 11:42 AM, Andr? Eriksen > wrote: > Hi > guys! > Finally I can > start building. Just rented a nice location outside town. > This is the drawing of the sub. I want to have 400meters > (1300ft) of max operating depth. The hull is 10mm > (3/8") S355J2 steel. The ABS hull calculator is giving > me 431,8m (1417ft) of depth, and 638,4m (2094ft) crush > depth. Still have som FEA to do. Have to learn to use a new > software since Autodesk Inventor don`t simulate buckling. > Any thoughts on the design?Do someone want to > confirm my calculations?Very excited to get > started!Sorry for the metric dimensions for you > who are not custom to them. > I had a hard time figuring out the > conning tower. I wanted it to go in one piece, but I want > all the freeboard I can get and not get it too top heavy. > Was thinking about going 20mm thick nozzle all the way up, > but thinking I might get in trouble welding in the hatch > seat ring. With 30mm I could do without welding in a seat > ring, but it would be too top heavy. So decided to go with > the Kittredge design, any thoughts on this? > Domes in top and front and saddle > tanks. > Emile: > If you still want to press domes for me, can you give me the > exact measurements I should have for the bow > ring? > -Andr? > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -- Med Vennlig Hilsen / Regards *Andr? Eriksen* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 16:30:23 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 13:30:23 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Surface support In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1422912623.47218.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Alec, My wife says NO! :-( Hank-------------------------------------------- On Mon, 2/2/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Surface support To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Monday, February 2, 2015, 2:51 PM Anyone looking for a cool surface support boat? This one cost $15M to build and is going for $180K. Probably takes that much to fill the tank, but you'll get to the dive spot in about 30 seconds... http://www.engadget.com/2015/02/02/wanna-buy-a-boat/ Much better appreciated in this other photo... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_Slice#mediaviewer/File:USN_experimental_Small_water_area_vessel.jpg Best, Alec ?? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 16:31:30 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 16:31:30 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector In-Reply-To: References: <1422895084.54629.YahooMailNeo@web181205.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8D20D46BDDEFA76-1714-10B1E@webmail-vm081.sysops.aol.com> 500' was standard. A K-250 was tank tested to 800+ with no hull damage (the acrylic semi imploded), and the K-350 built for a maritime cadet training academy in Japan spent several months at 600+ feet after being sunk with its mother ship in the Sea of Japan and was recovered without damage or leakage of any sort. Vance -----Original Message----- From: glen brown via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Mon, Feb 2, 2015 1:46 pm Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector Hi Does anyone know the max depth a k350 has ever been tested to. Thanks Glen On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:59 PM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Cliff, Great! Many thanks for that. I'm relieved. Regards James On 2 February 2015 at 16:38, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James, I have this bulkhead connector on my boat. I went out to my shop and did the wiggle test. Yes it feel rubbery so I think there is good chance that no damage was done. Cliff From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: "personal_submersibles at psubs.org" Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 10:06 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Bulkhead Connector Hi All, Could someone please do me a favour? I have the BH4F low power bulkhead connector fitted to my boat. Its running the transducer for the underwater comms. The other day I was moving the boat with trolley jacks and I think I may have hit the bulkhead connector as I jacked it up. The connector is fitted together with the male part and the 2 red retaining caps are screwed together. If I take the clips apart, and wiggle the two connectors, they feel "rubbery". Trouble is im not sure if it was like this before or if its been damaged. The radio still works ok and separating the connector shows no sign of damage, but im not 100% sure I still haven't damaged something inside the connector. I've just got the feeling something is broken inside and its now just touching together to make the connection. Can someone with this type of connector on their boat, unscrew the red retaining caps and let me know if the assembly feels a bit rubbery, or if its solid? Thanks in advance! James ? ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: BH4F.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 43661 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 16:37:00 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2015 16:37:00 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Surface support In-Reply-To: <1422912623.47218.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1422912623.47218.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: How UNREASONABLE On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 4:30 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Alec, > My wife says NO! :-( > Hank-------------------------------------------- > On Mon, 2/2/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Surface support > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Received: Monday, February 2, 2015, 2:51 PM > > Anyone looking for a > cool surface support boat? This one cost $15M to build and > is going for $180K. Probably takes that much to fill the > tank, but you'll get to the dive spot in about 30 > seconds... > http://www.engadget.com/2015/02/02/wanna-buy-a-boat/ > > > Much better appreciated in this other > photo... > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_Slice#mediaviewer/File:USN_experimental_Small_water_area_vessel.jpg > > > > Best, > > Alec > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 2 21:04:52 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 20:04:52 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Message-ID: Thanks for the info Alan! -Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott, but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module. SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Ele... SWE SeaSafe Autonomous, Smart Lithium-Ion Battery Modules View on www.swe.com Preview by Yahoo I couldn't remember their name, then looked at the T shirt they gave me at the last underwater intervention convention:) They will possibly be in New Orleans for this February's U. I. convention. There is an exhibitor list. Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 12:51 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine to keep the weight down. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Scott, the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by this North America company... http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco. The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual. There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about; lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense than lithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acid per kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of years when I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that will be fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphur in them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithium battery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air. Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 03:34:13 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 00:34:13 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks for the info Alan! > -Scott Waters > > > Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone > > > -------- Original message -------- > From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Cc: > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries > > Iam not sure about that battery Scott, > but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module. > SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group > > > > [image: image] > > > > > > SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Ele... > > SWE SeaSafe Autonomous, Smart Lithium-Ion Battery Modules > View on www.swe.com > Preview by Yahoo > > I couldn't remember their name, then looked at the T shirt they gave me > at the last underwater intervention convention:) > They will possibly be in New Orleans for this February's U. I. convention. > There is an exhibitor list. > Alan > > ------------------------------ > *From:* "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *Sent:* Tuesday, February 3, 2015 12:51 AM > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries > > Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they > contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine > to keep the weight down. > Thanks, > Scott Waters > > > Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone > > > -------- Original message -------- > From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Cc: > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries > > > > Scott, > the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by this > North America company... > http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ > At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco. > The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual. > There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited > about; > lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense than > lithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead > acid > per kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of > years > when I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that will > be fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym > sulphur > in them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a > lithium > battery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air. > Alan > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *To:* psubs > *Sent:* Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM > *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries > > I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable > to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and > use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a > source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate > them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light? > Thanks, > Scott Waters > > > Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 04:15:14 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 09:15:14 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1359617168.846620.1422954914081.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> WOW that's expensive.These Thundersky batteries are a good option.I remember Herve Jaubert saying he was using them in his ambient's,but in a battery pod, not compensated.Alan From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up? a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. ? Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks for the info Alan!-Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott,but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module.SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group | ? | | ? | | ? | ? | ? | ? | ? | | SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Ele...SWE SeaSafe Autonomous, Smart Lithium-Ion Battery Modules | | | | View on www.swe.com | Preview by Yahoo | | | | ? | ? I couldn't remember their name, then looked at the T shirt they gave me?at the last underwater intervention convention:)They will possibly be in New Orleans for this February's U. I. convention.There is an exhibitor list.Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 12:51 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine to keep the weight down.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Scott,the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by thisNorth America company...http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco.The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual.There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about;lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense thanlithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acidper kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of yearswhen I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that willbe fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphurin them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithiumbattery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air.Alan? ? From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 04:29:34 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 09:29:34 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: <1359617168.846620.1422954914081.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1359617168.846620.1422954914081.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <123998122.838139.1422955774106.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Tired, forgot to post the link.http://alliancerenewableenergy.com/Thunder-Sky-LiFeYPO4-Batteries_c3.htm ? Scott, I presume you are talking about keeping the weight down "under the water,"in which case if you went with battery pods instead of compensating, there wouldn't?be much difference, as you are putting square batteries in to roundbattery pods & there would be a lot of air space that would counter the weight of the pod.Alan From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 10:15 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries WOW that's expensive.These Thundersky batteries are a good option.I remember Herve Jaubert saying he was using them in his ambient's,but in a battery pod, not compensated.Alan From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up? a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. ? Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks for the info Alan!-Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott,but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module.SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group | ? | | ? | | ? | ? | ? | ? | ? | | SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Ele...SWE SeaSafe Autonomous, Smart Lithium-Ion Battery Modules | | | | View on www.swe.com | Preview by Yahoo | | | | ? | ? I couldn't remember their name, then looked at the T shirt they gave me?at the last underwater intervention convention:)They will possibly be in New Orleans for this February's U. I. convention.There is an exhibitor list.Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 12:51 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine to keep the weight down.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Scott,the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by thisNorth America company...http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco.The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual.There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about;lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense thanlithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acidper kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of yearswhen I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that willbe fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphurin them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithiumbattery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air.Alan? ? From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 07:10:36 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2015 06:10:36 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Message-ID: I think considering the price of foam, they are probably worth it to cut weight and add duration. I am going to have to make the next UI.? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/03/2015 2:34 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks for the info Alan! -Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott, but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module. SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Ele... SWE SeaSafe Autonomous, Smart Lithium-Ion Battery Modules View on www.swe.com Preview by Yahoo I couldn't remember their name, then looked at the T shirt they gave me at the last underwater intervention convention:) They will possibly be in New Orleans for this February's U. I. convention. There is an exhibitor list. Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 12:51 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine to keep the weight down. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Scott, the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by this North America company... http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco. The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual. There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about; lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense than lithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acid per kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of years when I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that will be fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphur in them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithium battery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air. Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 07:25:24 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2015 06:25:24 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Message-ID: Alan, I figured since the steel would have to be so thick on the battery pods, that they would be increadably heavy. I think I am going to go with 1.25" thick 516 gr 70 steel hull, the pod would probably have to be about 3/4" thick without doing the calc Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/03/2015 3:29 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Tired, forgot to post the link. http://alliancerenewableenergy.com/Thunder-Sky-LiFeYPO4-Batteries_c3.htm Scott, I presume you are talking about keeping the weight down "under the water," in which case if you went with battery pods instead of compensating, there wouldn't be much difference, as you are putting square batteries in to round battery pods & there would be a lot of air space that would counter the weight of the pod. Alan From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 10:15 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries WOW that's expensive. These Thundersky batteries are a good option. I remember Herve Jaubert saying he was using them in his ambient's, but in a battery pod, not compensated. Alan From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks for the info Alan! -Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott, but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module. SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Ele... SWE SeaSafe Autonomous, Smart Lithium-Ion Battery Modules View on www.swe.com Preview by Yahoo I couldn't remember their name, then looked at the T shirt they gave me at the last underwater intervention convention:) They will possibly be in New Orleans for this February's U. I. convention. There is an exhibitor list. Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 12:51 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Great info Alan. Do you know if those batteries are soild or do they contain air? I am wanting to do compensated batteries for my new submarine to keep the weight down. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:50 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Scott, the DW2000s are using lithium iron batteries manufactured by this North America company... http://beckettenergy.com/advanced-maritime-battery-systems/ At the bottom of the page is a link to their dealings with Nuytco. The DW2000 batteries are in sealed pods as per usual. There is a new battery technology that the electric car market is excited about; lithium sulphur. They have already proven to be 5 x more energy dense than lithium polymer batteries. They are also expected to be cheaper than lead acid per kilowatt of energy. I am hoping they will be available in a couple of years when I finish my next sub. So I am designing to have battery pods that will be fitted with lead acid batteries, but are hoping I can put lithiuym sulphur in them. What I am trying to do is avoid spending a huge amount on a lithium battery that will soon be superceded by the lithium sulphur or lithium air. Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: psubs Sent: Monday, February 2, 2015 3:18 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries I am working on my new sub design and am trying to do everything possable to keep the weight down. One of my thoughts is to not use AGM batteries and use lithium. A few questions about lithium batteries. Does anyone have a source for them? Also are they completely filled so you could compensate them? Maybe use the enclosure like Deep Sea Power and Light? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 09:49:57 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Seaquestor via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2015 06:49:57 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Message-ID: Hi Alan, what voltage value are you us r in to build your array? I think I would would need 10 -12 batteries to achieve the 36 volts. Potential max thruster amp draw, 190a - 240a. , average draw 40a. Needed run time 8 hrs. What battery would you use? David Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date: 02/03/2015 1:29 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Tired, forgot to post the link. http://alliancerenewableenergy.com/Thunder-Sky-LiFeYPO4-Batteries_c3.htm Scott, I presume you are talking about keeping the weight down "under the water," in which case if you went with battery pods instead of compensating, there wouldn't be much difference, as you are putting square batteries in to round battery pods & there would be a lot of air space that would counter the weight of the pod. Alan From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 10:15 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries WOW that's expensive. These Thundersky batteries are a good option. I remember Herve Jaubert saying he was using them in his ambient's, but in a battery pod, not compensated. Alan From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks for the info Alan! -Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott, but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module. SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 14:30:46 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 19:30:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <550572449.1028452.1422991846350.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Hi David,firstly here's a link to an article on electric vehicle battery prices.http://evsroll.com/Electric_Car_Battery_Cost.html Manual Thundersky Batterieshttp://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/Manuals/Thundersky%20Product%20Manual.pdf I am looking at 48V for my sub, but that won't be confirmedtill I have made a successful thruster. I won't need my batteriesfor a couple of years & are hanging out for the new technologylithium sulphur batteries.Hugh Fulton has a bit of experience with lithium iron batteriesif he should chime in.Most of the Winston (thundersky) batteries I have seen have a?maximum discharge of 100 amps and have a continuous draw?of 50 amps. I have seen traction lifepo4 batteries advertised byother companies. They may have higher max discharge rates.The battery amp hour rating is based on discharging over 20 hrs & you have a maximum depth of discharge of 80%, so at a guessaround 500 amp/hr.Alan ? From: Seaquestor via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2015 3:49 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Alan, what voltage value are you us r in to build your array? I think I would would need 10 -12 batteries to achieve the 36 volts. Potential max thruster amp draw, 190a - 240a. , average draw 40a. Needed run time 8 hrs. What battery would you use? David Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date: 02/03/2015 1:29 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Tired, forgot to post the link.http://alliancerenewableenergy.com/Thunder-Sky-LiFeYPO4-Batteries_c3.htm ? Scott, I presume you are talking about keeping the weight down "under the water,"in which case if you went with battery pods instead of compensating, there wouldn't?be much difference, as you are putting square batteries in to roundbattery pods & there would be a lot of air space that would counter the weight of the pod.Alan From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 10:15 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries WOW that's expensive.These Thundersky batteries are a good option.I remember Herve Jaubert saying he was using them in his ambient's,but in a battery pod, not compensated.Alan From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up? a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. ? Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks for the info Alan!-Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott,but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module.SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group | ? | | ? | | ? | ? | ? | ? | | _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 18:40:00 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2015 15:40:00 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Alabama Message-ID: <1423006800.69149.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Hi All, Is there a psubs member living in Alabama willing to help with some recon for me. Thanks Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 3 20:26:51 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2015 01:26:51 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: <550572449.1028452.1422991846350.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <550572449.1028452.1422991846350.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1953576491.1129052.1423013211924.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Should add that if the batteries are connected in seriesyou can x the discharge rate by the number of batteries.Also on the lithium batteries the max peak discharge rateis double the continuous rating.The Thundersky lifepo4 batteries I think are 3c, so the?500Ahr battery needed for your 8hr run time would havea continuous rating of 1500 amps & double that peak rate.Not that your wiring could take that.Confirm this before you buy. I think I am right!:)Alan From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2015 8:30 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi David,firstly here's a link to an article on electric vehicle battery prices.http://evsroll.com/Electric_Car_Battery_Cost.html Manual Thundersky Batterieshttp://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/Manuals/Thundersky%20Product%20Manual.pdf I am looking at 48V for my sub, but that won't be confirmedtill I have made a successful thruster. I won't need my batteriesfor a couple of years & are hanging out for the new technologylithium sulphur batteries.Hugh Fulton has a bit of experience with lithium iron batteriesif he should chime in.Most of the Winston (thundersky) batteries I have seen have a?maximum discharge of 100 amps and have a continuous draw?of 50 amps. I have seen traction lifepo4 batteries advertised byother companies. They may have higher max discharge rates.The battery amp hour rating is based on discharging over 20 hrs & you have a maximum depth of discharge of 80%, so at a guessaround 500 amp/hr.Alan ? From: Seaquestor via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2015 3:49 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Alan, what voltage value are you us r in to build your array? I think I would would need 10 -12 batteries to achieve the 36 volts. Potential max thruster amp draw, 190a - 240a. , average draw 40a. Needed run time 8 hrs. What battery would you use? David Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date: 02/03/2015 1:29 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Tired, forgot to post the link.http://alliancerenewableenergy.com/Thunder-Sky-LiFeYPO4-Batteries_c3.htm ? Scott, I presume you are talking about keeping the weight down "under the water,"in which case if you went with battery pods instead of compensating, there wouldn't?be much difference, as you are putting square batteries in to roundbattery pods & there would be a lot of air space that would counter the weight of the pod.Alan From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 10:15 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries WOW that's expensive.These Thundersky batteries are a good option.I remember Herve Jaubert saying he was using them in his ambient's,but in a battery pod, not compensated.Alan From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up? a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. ? Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks for the info Alan!-Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott,but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module.SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group | ? | | ? | | ? | ? | ? | ? | | _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 12:22:11 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Ken Martindale via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 12:22:11 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: <1953576491.1129052.1423013211924.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <550572449.1028452.1422991846350.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <1953576491.1129052.1423013211924.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000001d04168$46ec2630$d4c47290$@cfl.rr.com> If the batteries are in series you cannot multiply the discharge rate by the number of batteries since in series the current is the same for each battery. Assuming I understand what you are saying. Ken Martindale From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2015 8:27 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Should add that if the batteries are connected in series you can x the discharge rate by the number of batteries. Also on the lithium batteries the max peak discharge rate is double the continuous rating. The Thundersky lifepo4 batteries I think are 3c, so the 500Ahr battery needed for your 8hr run time would have a continuous rating of 1500 amps & double that peak rate. Not that your wiring could take that. Confirm this before you buy. I think I am right!:) Alan _____ From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2015 8:30 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi David, firstly here's a link to an article on electric vehicle battery prices. http://evsroll.com/Electric_Car_Battery_Cost.html Manual Thundersky Batteries http://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/Manuals/Thundersky%20Product%20Manual.pdf I am looking at 48V for my sub, but that won't be confirmed till I have made a successful thruster. I won't need my batteries for a couple of years & are hanging out for the new technology lithium sulphur batteries. Hugh Fulton has a bit of experience with lithium iron batteries if he should chime in. Most of the Winston (thundersky) batteries I have seen have a maximum discharge of 100 amps and have a continuous draw of 50 amps. I have seen traction lifepo4 batteries advertised by other companies. They may have higher max discharge rates. The battery amp hour rating is based on discharging over 20 hrs & you have a maximum depth of discharge of 80%, so at a guess around 500 amp/hr. Alan _____ From: Seaquestor via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2015 3:49 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Alan, what voltage value are you us r in to build your array? I think I would would need 10 -12 batteries to achieve the 36 volts. Potential max thruster amp draw, 190a - 240a. , average draw 40a. Needed run time 8 hrs. What battery would you use? David Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles > Date: 02/03/2015 1:29 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Tired, forgot to post the link. http://alliancerenewableenergy.com/Thunder-Sky-LiFeYPO4-Batteries_c3.htm Scott, I presume you are talking about keeping the weight down "under the water," in which case if you went with battery pods instead of compensating, there wouldn't be much difference, as you are putting square batteries in to round battery pods & there would be a lot of air space that would counter the weight of the pod. Alan _____ From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 10:15 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries WOW that's expensive. These Thundersky batteries are a good option. I remember Herve Jaubert saying he was using them in his ambient's, but in a battery pod, not compensated. Alan _____ From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Hi Scott, Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: Thanks for the info Alan! -Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles > Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott, but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module. SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 13:20:46 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 13:20:46 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation Message-ID: All, I recently posted my solution for an emergency buoy system for my K-250 in the Projects section of our site. It can be found under my submissions as K-250 Emergency Buoy. Please feel free to comment. While I still have bigger fish to fry on my project I find it helpful to keep forward progressing the smaller systems when needed. In this case I am trying to identify/add as many of the "attachment" type brackets I can think of before re sandblasting and painting the hull this summer. Steve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 13:30:54 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 12:30:54 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation Message-ID: Great job Steve! I am in the process of putting on a emergency bouy on my sub too.? Thanks, Scott Watets Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/05/2015 12:20 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation All, I recently posted my solution for an emergency buoy system for my K-250 in the Projects section of our site. It can be found under my submissions as K-250 Emergency Buoy. Please feel free to comment. While I still have bigger fish to fry on my project I find it helpful to keep forward progressing the smaller systems when needed. In this case I am trying to identify/add as many of the "attachment" type brackets I can think of before re sandblasting and painting the hull this summer. Steve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 14:25:03 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 19:25:03 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <803649140.256246.1423164303966.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Great project documentation thanks Steve.http://www.psubs.org/projects/1239373450/k-250emergencybuoy/ Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 6, 2015 7:30 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation Great job Steve! I am in the process of putting on a emergency bouy on my sub too.?Thanks,Scott Watets Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/05/2015 12:20 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation All, I recently posted my solution for an emergency buoy system for my K-250 in the Projects section of our site. It can be found under my submissions as K-250 Emergency Buoy. Please feel free to comment. While I still have bigger fish to fry on my project I find it helpful to keep forward progressing the smaller systems when needed.? In this case I am trying to identify/add as many of the "attachment" type brackets I can think of before re sandblasting and painting the hull this summer. Steve _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 14:26:13 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 19:26:13 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries In-Reply-To: <000001d04168$46ec2630$d4c47290$@cfl.rr.com> References: <000001d04168$46ec2630$d4c47290$@cfl.rr.com> Message-ID: <323986443.246700.1423164373461.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Thanks for the correction Ken,yes makes sense.Alan From: Ken Martindale via Personal_Submersibles To: 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' Sent: Friday, February 6, 2015 6:22 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries #yiv3601608402 #yiv3601608402 -- _filtered #yiv3601608402 {font-family:Helvetica;panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;} _filtered #yiv3601608402 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv3601608402 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}#yiv3601608402 #yiv3601608402 p.yiv3601608402MsoNormal, #yiv3601608402 li.yiv3601608402MsoNormal, #yiv3601608402 div.yiv3601608402MsoNormal {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv3601608402 a:link, #yiv3601608402 span.yiv3601608402MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv3601608402 a:visited, #yiv3601608402 span.yiv3601608402MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv3601608402 span {}#yiv3601608402 span.yiv3601608402EmailStyle18 {color:#1F497D;}#yiv3601608402 .yiv3601608402MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;} _filtered #yiv3601608402 {margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}#yiv3601608402 div.yiv3601608402WordSection1 {}#yiv3601608402 If the batteries are in series you cannot multiply the discharge rate by the number of batteries since in series the current is the same for each battery. ?Assuming I understand what you are saying. ?Ken Martindale ? From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2015 8:27 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries ?Should add that if the batteries are connected in seriesyou can x the discharge rate by the number of batteries.Also on the lithium batteries the max peak discharge rateis double the continuous rating.The Thundersky lifepo4 batteries I think are 3c, so the?500Ahr battery needed for your 8hr run time would havea continuous rating of 1500 amps & double that peak rate.Not that your wiring could take that.Confirm this before you buy. I think I am right!:)Alan ? ?From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2015 8:30 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries ?Hi David,firstly here's a link to an article on electric vehicle battery prices.http://evsroll.com/Electric_Car_Battery_Cost.htmlManual Thundersky Batterieshttp://www.thunderstruck-ev.com/Manuals/Thundersky%20Product%20Manual.pdfI am looking at 48V for my sub, but that won't be confirmedtill I have made a successful thruster. I won't need my batteriesfor a couple of years & are hanging out for the new technologylithium sulphur batteries.Hugh Fulton has a bit of experience with lithium iron batteriesif he should chime in.Most of the Winston (thundersky) batteries I have seen have a?maximum discharge of 100 amps and have a continuous draw?of 50 amps. I have seen traction lifepo4 batteries advertised byother companies. They may have higher max discharge rates.The battery amp hour rating is based on discharging over 20 hrs& you have a maximum depth of discharge of 80%, so at a guessaround 500 amp/hr.Alan ? ?? ? ?From: Seaquestor via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2015 3:49 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries ?Hi Alan, what voltage value are you us r in to build your array? I think I would would need 10 -12 batteries to achieve the 36 volts. Potential max thruster amp draw, 190a - 240a. , average draw 40a. Needed run time 8 hrs. What battery would you use? ?David ? ? ?Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date: 02/03/2015 1:29 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Tired, forgot to post the link.http://alliancerenewableenergy.com/Thunder-Sky-LiFeYPO4-Batteries_c3.htm ? Scott, I presume you are talking about keeping the weight down "under the water,"in which case if you went with battery pods instead of compensating, there wouldn't?be much difference, as you are putting square batteries in to roundbattery pods & there would be a lot of air space that would counter the weight of the pod.Alan ? ?From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 10:15 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries ?WOW that's expensive.These Thundersky batteries are a good option.I remember Herve Jaubert saying he was using them in his ambient's,but in a battery pod, not compensated.Alan ? ?From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 3, 2015 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries ?Hi Scott,Two years ago the cost was $7000 for a single battery when I attended the UI convention. They might be cheaper this year. Want me to pick you up? a couple, I know they are supposed to be at the the Ui event this year as well. Wy and I will be attending. I will need a bigger suit case to bring them home however. ? Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com ?On Mon, Feb 2, 2015 at 6:04 PM, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Thanks for the info Alan!-Scott Waters ? ?Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/02/2015 12:32 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lithium batteries Iam not sure about that battery Scott,but these are pressure resistant & have a compensation module.SWE Seasafe subsea Battery Modules SWE | Southwest Electronic Energy Group | ? | | ? | | ? | ? | ? | ? | | | | | | | | | | | | | | _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 15:52:30 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 15:52:30 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I like the way you pulled that off without the need for any machined parts, well done. The only thing I wonder about is whether the line bight could be somehow secured so that the reel doesn't feed out line if, for instance, you are under tow. Consider things like a bungee cord that releases along with the float, but constrains the line or the reel pre-release. Best, Alec On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 1:20 PM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > All, I recently posted my solution for an emergency buoy system for my > K-250 in the Projects section of our site. It can be found under my > submissions as K-250 Emergency Buoy. Please feel free to comment. > > While I still have bigger fish to fry on my project I find it helpful to > keep forward progressing the smaller systems when needed. In this case I > am trying to identify/add as many of the "attachment" type brackets I can > think of before re sandblasting and painting the hull this summer. > > Steve > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 19:06:21 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 19:06:21 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Alec, good point and one I did try to consider. What I like about the reel is that the drag adjustment seems to be pretty robust with a wide adjustment range. Hopefully I can find the sweet spot between free spooling while under tow (or by wave action) and having the float capable of still being able to pull line from the reel when needed. I believe with this design I still have some flexibility if I need to fine tune after some in water experience. Steve On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 3:52 PM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > I like the way you pulled that off without the need for any machined > parts, well done. The only thing I wonder about is whether the line bight > could be somehow secured so that the reel doesn't feed out line if, for > instance, you are under tow. Consider things like a bungee cord that > releases along with the float, but constrains the line or the reel > pre-release. > > Best, > > Alec > > > > On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 1:20 PM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> All, I recently posted my solution for an emergency buoy system for my >> K-250 in the Projects section of our site. It can be found under my >> submissions as K-250 Emergency Buoy. Please feel free to comment. >> >> While I still have bigger fish to fry on my project I find it helpful to >> keep forward progressing the smaller systems when needed. In this case I >> am trying to identify/add as many of the "attachment" type brackets I can >> think of before re sandblasting and painting the hull this summer. >> >> Steve >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 19:20:47 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2015 11:20:47 +1100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Steve, I'm a cave & ocean diver, and can tell you from experience that having an unsecured reel with line coming off it is a real pain and very tangly, even when you have hands to disentangle it. And it could still ruin a dive while you're fine-tuning it... Could you have a locking pin or something that prevents the reel from unspooling under normal circumstances, but is pulled out when the buoy is released? Cheers, SteveF On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 11:06 AM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Alec, good point and one I did try to consider. > > What I like about the reel is that the drag adjustment seems to be pretty > robust with a wide adjustment range. Hopefully I can find the sweet spot > between free spooling while under tow (or by wave action) and having the > float capable of still being able to pull line from the reel when needed. > > I believe with this design I still have some flexibility if I need to fine > tune after some in water experience. > > Steve > > On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 3:52 PM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> I like the way you pulled that off without the need for any machined >> parts, well done. The only thing I wonder about is whether the line bight >> could be somehow secured so that the reel doesn't feed out line if, for >> instance, you are under tow. Consider things like a bungee cord that >> releases along with the float, but constrains the line or the reel >> pre-release. >> >> Best, >> >> Alec >> >> >> >> On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 1:20 PM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >>> All, I recently posted my solution for an emergency buoy system for my >>> K-250 in the Projects section of our site. It can be found under my >>> submissions as K-250 Emergency Buoy. Please feel free to comment. >>> >>> While I still have bigger fish to fry on my project I find it helpful to >>> keep forward progressing the smaller systems when needed. In this case I >>> am trying to identify/add as many of the "attachment" type brackets I can >>> think of before re sandblasting and painting the hull this summer. >>> >>> Steve >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 5 20:59:45 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 20:59:45 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I concur. Snoopy's mechanism blocks the reel unless released, and I just did a small redo to that last year because it didn't block it quite firmly enough. Towing and waves could lead to a big mess of line, and what is more serious the mess could have prevented the buoy from releasing properly. Now the reel is more firmly retained. Alec On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 7:20 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi Steve, > I'm a cave & ocean diver, and can tell you from experience that having an > unsecured reel with line coming off it is a real pain and very tangly, even > when you have hands to disentangle it. And it could still ruin a dive > while you're fine-tuning it... > > Could you have a locking pin or something that prevents the reel from > unspooling under normal circumstances, but is pulled out when the buoy is > released? > > Cheers, > SteveF > > On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 11:06 AM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> Alec, good point and one I did try to consider. >> >> What I like about the reel is that the drag adjustment seems to be pretty >> robust with a wide adjustment range. Hopefully I can find the sweet spot >> between free spooling while under tow (or by wave action) and having the >> float capable of still being able to pull line from the reel when needed. >> >> I believe with this design I still have some flexibility if I need to >> fine tune after some in water experience. >> >> Steve >> >> On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 3:52 PM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >>> I like the way you pulled that off without the need for any machined >>> parts, well done. The only thing I wonder about is whether the line bight >>> could be somehow secured so that the reel doesn't feed out line if, for >>> instance, you are under tow. Consider things like a bungee cord that >>> releases along with the float, but constrains the line or the reel >>> pre-release. >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Alec >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 1:20 PM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles >>> wrote: >>> >>>> All, I recently posted my solution for an emergency buoy system for my >>>> K-250 in the Projects section of our site. It can be found under my >>>> submissions as K-250 Emergency Buoy. Please feel free to comment. >>>> >>>> While I still have bigger fish to fry on my project I find it helpful >>>> to keep forward progressing the smaller systems when needed. In this case >>>> I am trying to identify/add as many of the "attachment" type brackets I can >>>> think of before re sandblasting and painting the hull this summer. >>>> >>>> Steve >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 6 02:55:41 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2015 07:55:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Iceland Message-ID: <386725625.414903.1423209341223.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Carsten & Emile,what are you guys up to in Iceland, are you diving?Could tell you some warmer places to go on holiday.Alan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 6 08:08:49 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2015 08:08:49 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Emergency Buoy Implementation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks for the feedback. I will add a modification to improve the design. Thanks, Steve On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 8:59 PM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > I concur. Snoopy's mechanism blocks the reel unless released, and I just > did a small redo to that last year because it didn't block it quite firmly > enough. Towing and waves could lead to a big mess of line, and what is more > serious the mess could have prevented the buoy from releasing properly. Now > the reel is more firmly retained. > > Alec > > On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 7:20 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > >> Hi Steve, >> I'm a cave & ocean diver, and can tell you from experience that having an >> unsecured reel with line coming off it is a real pain and very tangly, even >> when you have hands to disentangle it. And it could still ruin a dive >> while you're fine-tuning it... >> >> Could you have a locking pin or something that prevents the reel from >> unspooling under normal circumstances, but is pulled out when the buoy is >> released? >> >> Cheers, >> SteveF >> >> On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 11:06 AM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles >> wrote: >> >>> Alec, good point and one I did try to consider. >>> >>> What I like about the reel is that the drag adjustment seems to be >>> pretty robust with a wide adjustment range. Hopefully I can find the sweet >>> spot between free spooling while under tow (or by wave action) and having >>> the float capable of still being able to pull line from the reel when >>> needed. >>> >>> I believe with this design I still have some flexibility if I need to >>> fine tune after some in water experience. >>> >>> Steve >>> >>> On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 3:52 PM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>> >>>> I like the way you pulled that off without the need for any machined >>>> parts, well done. The only thing I wonder about is whether the line bight >>>> could be somehow secured so that the reel doesn't feed out line if, for >>>> instance, you are under tow. Consider things like a bungee cord that >>>> releases along with the float, but constrains the line or the reel >>>> pre-release. >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> Alec >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 1:20 PM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> All, I recently posted my solution for an emergency buoy system for my >>>>> K-250 in the Projects section of our site. It can be found under my >>>>> submissions as K-250 Emergency Buoy. Please feel free to comment. >>>>> >>>>> While I still have bigger fish to fry on my project I find it helpful >>>>> to keep forward progressing the smaller systems when needed. In this case >>>>> I am trying to identify/add as many of the "attachment" type brackets I can >>>>> think of before re sandblasting and painting the hull this summer. >>>>> >>>>> Steve >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 6 13:11:07 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2015 13:11:07 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: <1422575889.79193.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1422575889.79193.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Finally got around to looking at your new photos. Cool : ) Any info. on the lake test (maybe I missed it)? Steve On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 6:58 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi guys, > I have posted pictures of my launch cart in action with Gamma onboard. > The cart can drive onto the trailer with Gamma on it. The cart spins out > at the top of the ramps because there is not enough traction on the frozen > wood deck. The ballast pontoons are temporary to establish what will work > best. Once I have it perfected I will have aluminum pontoons built. > Tomorrow I am driving out to a lake to test the cart's ballast system and > make sure of the freeboard before launching the sub. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 6 13:48:48 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2015 10:48:48 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1423248528.91110.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Steve, Thanks' the lake test was uneventful. The cart floated very even front to back but had a bad list. I corrected it by removing styro from the one ballast tank. The true test of the cart comes next week when I start diving Gamma. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/6/15, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 6, 2015, 1:11 PM Finally got around to looking at your new photos. Cool : )? Any info. on the lake test (maybe I missed it)? Steve On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 6:58 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi guys, I have posted pictures of my launch cart in action with Gamma onboard.? The cart can drive onto the trailer with Gamma on it.? The cart spins out at the top of the ramps because there is not enough traction on the frozen wood deck.? The ballast pontoons are temporary to establish what will work best.? Once I have it perfected I will have aluminum pontoons built.? Tomorrow I am driving out to a lake to test the cart's ballast system and make sure of the freeboard before launching the sub. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Feb 8 10:50:23 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (glen brown via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2015 17:50:23 +0200 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Iceland In-Reply-To: <386725625.414903.1423209341223.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <386725625.414903.1423209341223.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Alan Sorry for taking so long to reply ,yes I have moved to Port Elizabeth SA (East Coast).Back working on my K350 again determined to finish it this year (I Hope)Its good to see how some of the guys have advanced. Glen On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 9:55 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Carsten & Emile, > what are you guys up to in Iceland, are you diving? > Could tell you some warmer places to go on holiday. > Alan > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 9 04:57:22 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2015 09:57:22 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: <1423248528.91110.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423248528.91110.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: hi Hank, Any pics of the cart floating? Did you have the sub on the cart, or was it just a cart in the water test? Would be interesting to see the waterline etc. Sounds like it was a good trip. Regards James On 6 February 2015 at 18:48, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Steve, > Thanks' the lake test was uneventful. The cart floated very even front > to back but had a bad list. I corrected it by removing styro from the one > ballast tank. The true test of the cart comes next week when I start diving > Gamma. > Hank-------------------------------------------- > On Fri, 2/6/15, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Received: Friday, February 6, 2015, 1:11 PM > > Finally got around to looking at your new > photos. Cool : ) Any info. on the lake test (maybe I > missed it)? > > Steve > > On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at > 6:58 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote: > Hi > guys, > > I have posted pictures of my launch cart in action with > Gamma onboard. The cart can drive onto the trailer with > Gamma on it. The cart spins out at the top of the ramps > because there is not enough traction on the frozen wood > deck. The ballast pontoons are temporary to establish what > will work best. Once I have it perfected I will have > aluminum pontoons built. Tomorrow I am driving out to a > lake to test the cart's ballast system and make sure of > the freeboard before launching the sub. > > Hank > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 9 13:26:11 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Emile van Essen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2015 19:26:11 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Iceland In-Reply-To: <386725625.414903.1423209341223.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Alan, Carsten was not able to go so another friend joined me. Best part is that we won the trip as a price for a video about my sub! We went off road driving in a Landrover Discovery and snowmobiling. The original national price was a trip to New Mexico and main price a trip to space with Virgin galactic. The price was changed due to the tragic accident with Spaceship 2 . Best regards, Emile _____ Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: vrijdag 6 februari 2015 8:56 Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Iceland Carsten & Emile, what are you guys up to in Iceland, are you diving? Could tell you some warmer places to go on holiday. Alan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 9 15:04:05 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2015 20:04:05 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Iceland In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1924776304.1316902.1423512245334.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Wow, very lucky.?would be quite an experience.I had a stop over there for a few hours & it looked like the surface of the moon.Promotional videos showed it to be very interesting though.Is there a link to the video you won with?Alan From: Emile van Essen via Personal_Submersibles To: 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2015 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Iceland #yiv1224810697 #yiv1224810697 -- _filtered #yiv1224810697 {font-family:Helvetica;panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;} _filtered #yiv1224810697 {font-family:Tahoma;panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}#yiv1224810697 #yiv1224810697 p.yiv1224810697MsoNormal, #yiv1224810697 li.yiv1224810697MsoNormal, #yiv1224810697 div.yiv1224810697MsoNormal {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv1224810697 a:link, #yiv1224810697 span.yiv1224810697MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv1224810697 a:visited, #yiv1224810697 span.yiv1224810697MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv1224810697 span.yiv1224810697E-mailStijl17 {font-family:Arial;color:navy;} _filtered #yiv1224810697 {margin:70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt;}#yiv1224810697 div.yiv1224810697Section1 {}#yiv1224810697 Hi Alan, ? Carsten was not able togo so another friend joined me. Best part is that we wonthe trip as a price for a video about my sub! We went off road drivingin a Landrover Discovery and snowmobiling. ? ? The original nationalprice ?was a trip to New Mexico and main price a trip to space with Virgin galactic. The price was changed dueto the tragic accident with Spaceship 2 . ? Best regards, Emile ? ? Van: Personal_Submersibles[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: vrijdag 6 februari 20158:56 Aan: Personal Submersibles GeneralDiscussion Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Iceland ? Carsten& Emile, whatare you guys up to in Iceland, are you diving? Couldtell you some warmer places to go on holiday. Alan _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 13:35:21 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:35:21 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine Message-ID: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> --- On Tue, 2/10/15, hank pronk wrote: > From: hank pronk > Subject: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" > Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 1:33 PM > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/II-World-War-Personal-Electric-Delphin-Submarine-/291372734441?pt=Other_Boats > > Hey guys, That neat little German sub is on ebay. They are asking 75K I made an offer but no luck. Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 14:25:00 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (=?ISO-8859-1?b?IkNhcnN0ZW4gU3RhbmRmdd8i?= via Personal_Submersibles) Date: 10 Feb 2015 19:25 GMT Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine In-Reply-To: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1YLGQp-0VhIXY0@fwd16.t-online.de> Hank this is not a Delphin. Delphin was build 1944-45 in Germany and not 1940. The delphin has the Dome more forward. I think this is a pre-war copy. And a bad one. Some picture of the original are here - scroll down.. http://coollib.com/b/280443/read vbr Carsten "hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles" schrieb: > > > --- On Tue, 2/10/15, hank pronk wrote: > > > From: hank pronk > > Subject: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine > > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" > > Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 1:33 PM > > > > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/II-World-War-Personal-Electric-Delphin-Submarine-/291372734441?pt=Other_Boats > > > > Hey guys, > That neat little German sub is on ebay. They are asking 75K I made an offer but no luck. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 14:42:14 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 14:42:14 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine In-Reply-To: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: That's interesting... I recall the same little sub being on sale in Argentina about a year ago and Carsten saying he doubted it was authentic. They must have got it to Miami in the hope of finding a buyer more readily. On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 1:35 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > > --- On Tue, 2/10/15, hank pronk wrote: > > > From: hank pronk > > Subject: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine > > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" > > Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 1:33 PM > > > > > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/II-World-War-Personal-Electric-Delphin-Submarine-/291372734441?pt=Other_Boats > > > > Hey guys, > That neat little German sub is on ebay. They are asking 75K I made an > offer but no luck. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 15:05:42 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 20:05:42 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine In-Reply-To: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1979869474.1684257.1423598742973.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> I remember Carsten saying that if it was German, then he was American.But if you click on the image on Hank's ebay link more images come up, & one is ofsome plans, which look pretty similar to the plans of the Delphin 1 onCarstens link.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2015 7:35 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine --- On Tue, 2/10/15, hank pronk wrote: > From: hank pronk > Subject: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" > Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 1:33 PM > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/II-World-War-Personal-Electric-Delphin-Submarine-/291372734441?pt=Other_Boats > ??? ??? ??? ? ??? ??? ? > Hey guys, That neat little German sub is on ebay.? They are asking 75K? I made an offer but no luck. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 15:09:42 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 12:09:42 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine In-Reply-To: <1979869474.1684257.1423598742973.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1423598982.22749.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> The sub has no historical significance to me, I offered 5K and to me that is what it is worth. For 5K it could be a fun little shallow sub. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Tue, 2/10/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 3:05 PM I remember Carsten saying that if it was German, then he was American.But if you click on the image on Hank's ebay link more images come up, & one is ofsome plans, which look pretty similar to the plans of the Delphin 1 onCarstens link.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2015 7:35 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine --- On Tue, 2/10/15, hank pronk wrote: > From: hank pronk > Subject: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" > Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 1:33 PM > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/II-World-War-Personal-Electric-Delphin-Submarine-/291372734441?pt=Other_Boats > ??? ??? ??? ? ??? ??? ? > Hey guys, That neat little German sub is on ebay.? They are asking 75K? I made an offer but no luck. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 15:18:47 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 12:18:47 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] vacuum pack Message-ID: <1423599527.9679.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> I am loading Gamma with survival stuff etc for my up coming dives. I discovered how great vacuum bags are. I put my emersion suit in one because it is so bulky. Great invention! Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 17:00:50 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 16:00:50 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lake Seneca Diving Trip Message-ID: Members, Alec and myself are planning a diving trip in lake Seneca New York April 20-24. We are in need of a support crew and boat(s). Al Secor has offered to help and use his boat, however he can not make this date work due to logistic issues and he thinks there is a possability June might work. Alec and I are inviting anybody who would like to assist and anyone who has a boat(s). There would be two submarines "Snoopy" and "Trustworthy".? Thank you, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 17:31:00 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (=?ISO-8859-1?b?IkNhcnN0ZW4gU3RhbmRmdd8i?= via Personal_Submersibles) Date: 10 Feb 2015 22:31 GMT Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine In-Reply-To: References: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1YLJLD-2CICvI0@fwd25.t-online.de> Hi Alec I never say it is authentic.. I say that: from the archive : Alec this is maybe a German.. And was original a mine hunter bouy (Tiefendrachen or Scherschwimmer) from the 60-70ies - some of them have this kind of boltet skegs/fins. To easy remove damage fins. http://www.7tes-msg.de/museumsschiff/dresden-april-2009/raeum-1.jpg http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/56/Lindau-Klasse_Heck_mit_Winden.JPG Clear the sub was not a navy device - the interior outfitting indicate in all details a low level private build. vbr Carsten -------------------------------- Its clear not authentic.. Not even close.. They wrote: Characteristics: It is 40 inches total width (101 cm), 16 feet total lenght (4.90 mts), and weighs 3086 lbs (1400 kg) . It has a 24 volts Siemens engine (original) with 2.5 HP The 3 only original delphin's was 100 cm diameter and 5,48 m long , displacment was 2,467 m3 or 2,664m3 Inside installed was a complete Sternsektion of a 32 HP Torpedo G7e. The sub was a dynamic diver with a small harttank and weight and displacement must be nearyl the same : around 2,5 ts - not 1,4.. 3 Delphins was build..7-1944 U 2544, 2547, 2548 Shells made at the same 400ts metal sheet press at the Borgward Car facility, Bremen were the made the V2 rocket nose shells. Assambeld at the Ami-Budd facilities in Berlin. And all 3 were blown up at the war ends near P?teniz- L?beck. One was "restored" and show in Florida with other midget from Italy and Germany in Florida (I think in Ft.Lauderdale) short after the war. Would be interessting to figure out what with this no.3 was happend later in the US. Maybe scrapped but maybe somewere still in store. vbr Carsten "Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles" schrieb: That's interesting... I recall the same little sub being on sale in Argentina about a year ago and Carsten saying he doubted it was authentic. They must have got it to Miami in the hope of finding a buyer more readily. On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 1:35 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: --- On Tue, 2/10/15, hank pronk wrote: > From: hank pronk > Subject: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" > Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 1:33 PM > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/II-World-War-Personal-Electric-Delphin-Submarine-/291372734441?pt=Other_Boats > > Hey guys, That neat little German sub is on ebay. They are asking 75K I made an offer but no luck. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 17:35:00 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (=?ISO-8859-1?b?IkNhcnN0ZW4gU3RhbmRmdd8i?= via Personal_Submersibles) Date: 10 Feb 2015 22:35 GMT Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine In-Reply-To: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1YLJOZ-1hpd1k0@fwd38.t-online.de> That was how it real looks.. vbr Carsten "hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles" schrieb: > > > --- On Tue, 2/10/15, hank pronk wrote: > > > From: hank pronk > > Subject: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine > > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" > > Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 1:33 PM > > > > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/II-World-War-Personal-Electric-Delphin-Submarine-/291372734441?pt=Other_Boats > > > > Hey guys, > That neat little German sub is on ebay. They are asking 75K I made an offer but no luck. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: DelphinZ1.JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 78263 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 18:02:18 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Private via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 18:02:18 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine In-Reply-To: <1YLJLD-2CICvI0@fwd25.t-online.de> References: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <1YLJLD-2CICvI0@fwd25.t-online.de> Message-ID: <2EF90592-2251-4E3E-9AC0-D083085CE2F1@gmail.com> Maybe a language issue... We are saying exactly the same thing. BTW I see a lot of the dials are a brand "BRD" that was a common automotive stuff in Argentina when I was growing up. Plus everything labeled in Spanish. Whatever this is, someone in Argentina seems to have refurbished it a few decades ago. :) > On Feb 10, 2015, at 5:31 PM, Carsten Standfu? via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi Alec I never say it is authentic.. > > I say that: from the archive : > Alec this is maybe a German.. > > And was original a mine hunter bouy (Tiefendrachen or Scherschwimmer) > from the 60-70ies - some of them have this kind of boltet skegs/fins. > To easy remove damage fins. > > http://www.7tes-msg.de/museumsschiff/dresden-april-2009/raeum-1.jpg > > http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/56/Lindau-Klasse_Heck_mit_Winden.JPG > > Clear the sub was not a navy device - the interior outfitting indicate > in all details a low level private build. > > vbr Carsten > -------------------------------- > > Its clear not authentic.. Not even close.. > > They wrote: > Characteristics: > It is 40 inches total width (101 cm), 16 feet total lenght (4.90 mts), and weighs 3086 lbs (1400 kg) . It has a 24 volts Siemens engine (original) with 2.5 HP > > The 3 only original delphin's was 100 cm diameter and 5,48 m long , displacment was 2,467 m3 or 2,664m3 > Inside installed was a complete Sternsektion of a 32 HP Torpedo G7e. > The sub was a dynamic diver with a small harttank and weight and displacement must be nearyl the same : around 2,5 ts - not 1,4.. > > 3 Delphins was build..7-1944 U 2544, 2547, 2548 > Shells made at the same 400ts metal sheet press at the Borgward Car facility, Bremen were the made the V2 rocket nose shells. > Assambeld at the Ami-Budd facilities in Berlin. > And all 3 were blown up at the war ends near P?teniz- L?beck. One was "restored" and show in Florida with other midget from Italy and > Germany in Florida (I think in Ft.Lauderdale) short after the war. Would be interessting to figure out what with this no.3 was happend later in the US. Maybe scrapped but maybe somewere still in store. > > vbr Carsten > > > "Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles" schrieb: > That's interesting... I recall the same little sub being on sale in Argentina about a year ago and Carsten saying he doubted it was authentic. They must have got it to Miami in the hope of finding a buyer more readily. > >> On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 1:35 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> >> --- On Tue, 2/10/15, hank pronk wrote: >> >> > From: hank pronk >> > Subject: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine >> > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" >> > Received: Tuesday, February 10, 2015, 1:33 PM >> > >> > >> > >> > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/II-World-War-Personal-Electric-Delphin-Submarine-/291372734441?pt=Other_Boats >> > >> > Hey guys, >> That neat little German sub is on ebay. They are asking 75K I made an offer but no luck. >> Hank >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 10 19:07:28 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jens Laland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 01:07:28 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: II World War Personal Electric Delphin Submarine In-Reply-To: <1YLJOZ-1hpd1k0@fwd38.t-online.de> References: <1423593321.74071.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <1YLJOZ-1hpd1k0@fwd38.t-online.de> Message-ID: <54DA9D40.6030502@artematrix.org> Gentlemen I have just uploaded 16 drawings related to the German WWII (1945) Delphin 'miniature submarine' design, which are now available for download through my web server, ref http://traktoria.org/files/Delphin_1945/ Best regards, Jens Laland From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 06:27:27 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 06:27:27 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] vacuum pack In-Reply-To: <1423599527.9679.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423599527.9679.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Good idea. Besides the size reduction it should also stay nice and dry. Steve On Tue, Feb 10, 2015 at 3:18 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > I am loading Gamma with survival stuff etc for my up coming dives. I > discovered how great vacuum bags are. I put my emersion suit in one > because it is so bulky. Great invention! > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 10:39:07 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 09:39:07 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Message-ID: <7pihe568alt9ss6d2a3md68m.1423669147329@email.android.com> Hank, I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders ?for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 12:12:40 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 09:12:40 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: <7pihe568alt9ss6d2a3md68m.1423669147329@email.android.com> Message-ID: <1423674760.76523.YahooMailMobile@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 12:23:54 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 11:23:54 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Message-ID: Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil.? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 11:12 AM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank From: swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ; To: psubs ; Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM Hank, I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 13:21:20 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 10:21:20 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1423678880.12733.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> No problems, Gamma has air cylinders and at 1,000 feet the hydraulic pump is set at 1,100 psi. Your K sub can have a pressure setting of 500 or less and work just fine. Remember, your not lifting a lot just the arm plus a bit. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil.?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 11:12 AM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank From: swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ; To: psubs ; Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders ?for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 13:22:17 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 10:22:17 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1423678937.48735.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Plus the water pressure pushing against you 5/8 rods-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil.?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 11:12 AM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank From: swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ; To: psubs ; Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders ?for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 13:52:02 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 18:52:02 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: <1423678880.12733.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423678880.12733.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1060413544.2031659.1423680722441.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Hank,why not just use air if the pneumatic cylinders are rated for 150 psi.If they are rated for 150 psi it would be assumed that their mechanical strengthwould match the load they can lift with 150 psi also.Is there any advantage other than the o ring working both ways to stop wateringress, as you have said previously. Does anyone else use them in placeof hydraulic cylinders?Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 7:21 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator No problems, Gamma has air cylinders and at 1,000 feet the hydraulic pump is set at 1,100 psi.? Your K sub can have a pressure setting of 500 or less and work just fine. Remember, your not lifting a lot just the arm plus a bit. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil.?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015? 11:12 AM? (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? From: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ;? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? To: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? psubs ;? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Subject: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Sent: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders ?for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 14:09:05 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:09:05 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Message-ID: Makes sence. Thanks Hank. I am planning on using the electrically controled silonoids and the pump all inmersed within the resevor and compensated so I should have the same motion regaurdless of depth. The nice thing about this design is it all is controlled through a subconn and no oil in the pressure vessel. But we will see when I am done.? Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 12:22 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Plus the water pressure pushing against you 5/8 rods-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil. Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 11:12 AM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank From: swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ; To: psubs ; Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 14:17:18 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:17:18 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Message-ID: <4h3xe7rb70fuyf508pamvbd6.1423681850194@email.android.com> Alan,? I looked into air, but it presents some problems. One is compensating it otherwise you will get less preformance based on depth. Two is they are not as stiff and have give as well as less fine control. Also another problem is if you used compressed air, you have a limiting factor or you could use a compressor, but have to have a bank to draw from. The main draw back of hydraulic for me was the mess and polution factor. Otherwise, hydraulic seems to be the way to go. I am hoping to come up with a manipulator design that can be used on most psubs that is easy and affordable. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 12:52 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Hank, why not just use air if the pneumatic cylinders are rated for 150 psi. If they are rated for 150 psi it would be assumed that their mechanical strength would match the load they can lift with 150 psi also. Is there any advantage other than the o ring working both ways to stop water ingress, as you have said previously. Does anyone else use them in place of hydraulic cylinders? Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 7:21 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator No problems, Gamma has air cylinders and at 1,000 feet the hydraulic pump is set at 1,100 psi. Your K sub can have a pressure setting of 500 or less and work just fine. Remember, your not lifting a lot just the arm plus a bit. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil. Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 11:12 AM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank From: swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ; To: psubs ; Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 15:37:16 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:37:16 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1423687036.73910.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Scott, What are you driving the pump with? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 2:09 PM Makes sence. Thanks Hank. I am planning on using the electrically controled silonoids and the pump all inmersed within the resevor and compensated so I should have the same motion regaurdless of depth. The nice thing about this design is it all is controlled through a subconn and no oil in the pressure vessel. But we will see when I am done.?Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 12:22 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Plus the water pressure pushing against you 5/8 rods-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil.?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015? 11:12 AM? (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank?????????? ???????????????? ???????????????????? ???????????????????? ???????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????? From: ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ;??????????????????? ??????? ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????? To: ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? psubs ;??????????????????? ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????? Subject: ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator???? ?????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????? Sent: ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM??? ??????????????????????? ???????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????? Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders ?for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone ???????????????????? ???????????????? ???????????? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 15:39:13 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:39:13 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: <4h3xe7rb70fuyf508pamvbd6.1423681850194@email.android.com> Message-ID: <1423687153.24356.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Scott, All oils used on the water should be environmentally friendly. I use vegetable oil in my launch cart. Hank -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 2:17 PM Alan,?I looked into air, but it presents some problems. One is compensating it otherwise you will get less preformance based on depth. Two is they are not as stiff and have give as well as less fine control. Also another problem is if you used compressed air, you have a limiting factor or you could use a compressor, but have to have a bank to draw from.The main draw back of hydraulic for me was the mess and polution factor. Otherwise, hydraulic seems to be the way to go.I am hoping to come up with a manipulator design that can be used on most psubs that is easy and affordable.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 12:52 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Hank,why not just use air if the pneumatic cylinders are rated for 150 psi.If they are rated for 150 psi it would be assumed that their mechanical strengthwould match the load they can lift with 150 psi also.Is there any advantage other than the o ring working both ways to stop wateringress, as you have said previously. Does anyone else use them in placeof hydraulic cylinders?Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 7:21 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator No problems, Gamma has air cylinders and at 1,000 feet the hydraulic pump is set at 1,100 psi.? Your K sub can have a pressure setting of 500 or less and work just fine. Remember, your not lifting a lot just the arm plus a bit. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil.?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015? 11:12 AM? (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? From: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ;? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? To: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? psubs ;? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Subject: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Sent: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders ?for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 15:42:03 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:42:03 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] german sub Message-ID: <1423687323.46807.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> I have been talking with the seller about the German sub. He is good at not answering tough questions. Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 15:54:17 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 15:54:17 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question Message-ID: All, I am removing my old K-250 hatch dome. It looks like it has been installed with a product like Sikaflex (I'd guess). I would like to not destroy it if possible (or the hatch). It really doesn't want to come out. I am thinking about heating the hatch's metal ring where the dome is seated to maybe break down the sealant or soften the acrylic. I have a concern about the heat warping or otherwise affecting the metal of the hatch. Any input? Steve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 15:58:26 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 14:58:26 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Message-ID: <1lebnr0ser3qxmjwkj4iumw2.1423688306872@email.android.com> Some form of electric motor. Haven't gotten that far yet.? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 2:37 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Scott, What are you driving the pump with? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 2:09 PM Makes sence. Thanks Hank. I am planning on using the electrically controled silonoids and the pump all inmersed within the resevor and compensated so I should have the same motion regaurdless of depth. The nice thing about this design is it all is controlled through a subconn and no oil in the pressure vessel. But we will see when I am done. Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 12:22 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Plus the water pressure pushing against you 5/8 rods-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil. Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 11:12 AM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank From: swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ; To: psubs ; Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 15:59:14 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 14:59:14 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Message-ID: Only thing is I have to be sure the oil I use is non-conductive. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 2:39 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Scott, All oils used on the water should be environmentally friendly. I use vegetable oil in my launch cart. Hank -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 2:17 PM Alan, I looked into air, but it presents some problems. One is compensating it otherwise you will get less preformance based on depth. Two is they are not as stiff and have give as well as less fine control. Also another problem is if you used compressed air, you have a limiting factor or you could use a compressor, but have to have a bank to draw from.The main draw back of hydraulic for me was the mess and polution factor. Otherwise, hydraulic seems to be the way to go.I am hoping to come up with a manipulator design that can be used on most psubs that is easy and affordable.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 12:52 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Hank,why not just use air if the pneumatic cylinders are rated for 150 psi.If they are rated for 150 psi it would be assumed that their mechanical strengthwould match the load they can lift with 150 psi also.Is there any advantage other than the o ring working both ways to stop wateringress, as you have said previously. Does anyone else use them in placeof hydraulic cylinders?Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 7:21 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator No problems, Gamma has air cylinders and at 1,000 feet the hydraulic pump is set at 1,100 psi. Your K sub can have a pressure setting of 500 or less and work just fine. Remember, your not lifting a lot just the arm plus a bit. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil. Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 11:12 AM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank From: swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ; To: psubs ; Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 16:05:21 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:05:21 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1423688721.55862.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Scott, you can use a trolling motor to drive the pump, just make sure the rest of the system can handle the type of oil you need to use. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 3:59 PM Only thing is I have to be sure the oil I use is non-conductive.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 2:39 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Scott, All oils used on the water should be environmentally friendly.? I use vegetable oil in my launch cart. Hank -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 2:17 PM Alan,?I looked into air, but it presents some problems. One is compensating it otherwise you will get less preformance based on depth. Two is they are not as stiff and have give as well as less fine control. Also another problem is if you used compressed air, you have a limiting factor or you could use a compressor, but have to have a bank to draw from.The main draw back of hydraulic for me was the mess and polution factor. Otherwise, hydraulic seems to be the way to go.I am hoping to come up with a manipulator design that can be used on most psubs that is easy and affordable.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015? 12:52 PM? (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Hank,why not just use air if the pneumatic cylinders are rated for 150 psi.If they are rated for 150 psi it would be assumed that their mechanical strengthwould match the load they can lift with 150 psi also.Is there any advantage other than the o ring working both ways to stop wateringress, as you have said previously. Does anyone else use them in placeof hydraulic cylinders?Alan ???? ??? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 7:21 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator ?? No problems, Gamma has air cylinders and at 1,000 feet the hydraulic pump is set at 1,100 psi.? Your K sub can have a pressure setting of 500 or less and work just fine. Remember, your not lifting a lot just the arm plus a bit. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator ? To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ? Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM ? ? Do you ? have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic ? cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil.?Thanks,Scott ? Waters ? Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone ? -------- Original message ? -------- ? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles ? ? Date:02/11/2015? 11:12 AM? (GMT-06:00) ? To: personal_submersibles ? Cc: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator ? ? hi Scott ? use a ? hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic ? cylinders ? Hank? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? From: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? swaters at waters-ks.com via ? Personal_Submersibles ;? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? To: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? psubs ? ;? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? Subject: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Sent: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? Hank,I know you ? said to use pnumatic cylinders ?for the manipulator arm. ? What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters ? Sent from my U.S. ? Cellular? ? Smartphone ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? ? ? ? ?? ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- ? _______________________________________________ ? Personal_Submersibles mailing list ? Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ? http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ??? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 16:06:38 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 21:06:38 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: <4h3xe7rb70fuyf508pamvbd6.1423681850194@email.android.com> References: <4h3xe7rb70fuyf508pamvbd6.1423681850194@email.android.com> Message-ID: <1065443526.2083934.1423688798763.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Hi Scott,I was more advocating using hydraulic cylinders with a hydraulic system.However Phil had a pneumatically operated manipulator on a K stylesub he manufactured. Mainly I think for simplicity & cost.For commercial use maybe the pneumatics would be limited; but there?would be plenty of air if you just wanted to pick up a gold bar if you?happened upon one.A divers regulator gives you 130psi above ambient so compensating is not a?problem. Perhaps some overpressure valves for expansion on ascent.I would think the pneumatics would be OK moving your manipulatorto the target, but bouncy once you picked up a load & were moving it.Vance would know.Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 8:17 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Alan,?I looked into air, but it presents some problems. One is compensating it otherwise you will get less preformance based on depth. Two is they are not as stiff and have give as well as less fine control. Also another problem is if you used compressed air, you have a limiting factor or you could use a compressor, but have to have a bank to draw from.The main draw back of hydraulic for me was the mess and polution factor. Otherwise, hydraulic seems to be the way to go.I am hoping to come up with a manipulator design that can be used on most psubs that is easy and affordable.Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 12:52 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Hank,why not just use air if the pneumatic cylinders are rated for 150 psi.If they are rated for 150 psi it would be assumed that their mechanical strengthwould match the load they can lift with 150 psi also.Is there any advantage other than the o ring working both ways to stop wateringress, as you have said previously. Does anyone else use them in placeof hydraulic cylinders?Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 7:21 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator No problems, Gamma has air cylinders and at 1,000 feet the hydraulic pump is set at 1,100 psi.? Your K sub can have a pressure setting of 500 or less and work just fine. Remember, your not lifting a lot just the arm plus a bit. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil.?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015? 11:12 AM? (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? From: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ;? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? To: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? psubs ;? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Subject: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Sent: ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders ?for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 16:07:26 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:07:26 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1423688846.60956.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Steve, That sounds like a bad idea, you could damage the dome with the heat. Can you slip a blade between the dome and seat? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 3:54 PM All, I am removing my old K-250 hatch dome.? It looks like it has been installed with a product like Sikaflex (I'd guess). ? I would like to not destroy it if possible (or the hatch).? It really doesn't want to come out. I am thinking about heating the hatch's metal ring where the dome is seated to maybe break down the sealant or soften the acrylic.? I have a concern about the heat warping or otherwise affecting the metal of the hatch. Any input? Steve -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 16:33:18 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 16:33:18 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question In-Reply-To: <1423688846.60956.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423688846.60956.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, the dome has no life left so I can bust/cut it out with a hammer, drill or a chainsaw if needed. I tried the blade idea but not much luck. I only wanted to keep it in 1 piece as a reference for my new dome. It probably isn't needed even for that. I have been reminded my hatch ring is what I need to protect and therefore heating might not be a great idea. Steve On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 4:07 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Steve, > That sounds like a bad idea, you could damage the dome with the heat. Can > you slip a blade between the dome and seat? > Hank-------------------------------------------- > On Wed, 2/11/15, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 3:54 PM > > All, I > am removing my old K-250 hatch dome. It looks like it has > been installed with a product like Sikaflex (I'd > guess). > > I would like to not destroy it if possible (or the > hatch). It really doesn't want to come out. > > I am thinking about heating the hatch's metal ring > where the dome is seated to maybe break down the sealant or > soften the acrylic. I have a concern about the heat > warping or otherwise affecting the metal of the hatch. > > Any input? > > Steve > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 16:33:28 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 16:33:28 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator In-Reply-To: <1065443526.2083934.1423688798763.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <4h3xe7rb70fuyf508pamvbd6.1423681850194@email.android.com> <1065443526.2083934.1423688798763.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8D2145982001074-C78-3EFCB@webmail-va149.sysops.aol.com> I think Alan may be right about the bounciness, but the real charm for that system is that you can run it with 3-way valves and not have the added charms of a hydraulic system. That was the idea with the Nuytco sub. Simplicity and low cost. Vance -----Original Message----- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 4:11 pm Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Hi Scott, I was more advocating using hydraulic cylinders with a hydraulic system. However Phil had a pneumatically operated manipulator on a K style sub he manufactured. Mainly I think for simplicity & cost. For commercial use maybe the pneumatics would be limited; but there would be plenty of air if you just wanted to pick up a gold bar if you happened upon one. A divers regulator gives you 130psi above ambient so compensating is not a problem. Perhaps some overpressure valves for expansion on ascent. I would think the pneumatics would be OK moving your manipulator to the target, but bouncy once you picked up a load & were moving it. Vance would know. Alan From: "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 8:17 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Alan, I looked into air, but it presents some problems. One is compensating it otherwise you will get less preformance based on depth. Two is they are not as stiff and have give as well as less fine control. Also another problem is if you used compressed air, you have a limiting factor or you could use a compressor, but have to have a bank to draw from. The main draw back of hydraulic for me was the mess and polution factor. Otherwise, hydraulic seems to be the way to go. I am hoping to come up with a manipulator design that can be used on most psubs that is easy and affordable. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 12:52 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Hank, why not just use air if the pneumatic cylinders are rated for 150 psi. If they are rated for 150 psi it would be assumed that their mechanical strength would match the load they can lift with 150 psi also. Is there any advantage other than the o ring working both ways to stop water ingress, as you have said previously. Does anyone else use them in place of hydraulic cylinders? Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 7:21 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator No problems, Gamma has air cylinders and at 1,000 feet the hydraulic pump is set at 1,100 psi. Your K sub can have a pressure setting of 500 or less and work just fine. Remember, your not lifting a lot just the arm plus a bit. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 12:23 PM Do you have any problem with over pressure though? The pnuematic cylinders are rated to 150psi with air and 1000 psi with oil. Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 11:12 AM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator hi Scott use a hydraulic pump just the same as if you used hydraulic cylinders Hank From: swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles ; To: psubs ; Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Manipulator Sent: Wed, Feb 11, 2015 3:39:07 PM Hank,I know you said to use pnumatic cylinders for the manipulator arm. What kind of pump do you use?Thanks,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 16:40:21 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Emile van Essen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 22:40:21 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Probably one part has to be offered.. Once I cut the ring in 5 pieces to save a dome. Emile _____ Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: woensdag 11 februari 2015 22:33 Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Onderwerp: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question Hank, the dome has no life left so I can bust/cut it out with a hammer, drill or a chainsaw if needed. I tried the blade idea but not much luck. I only wanted to keep it in 1 piece as a reference for my new dome. It probably isn't needed even for that. I have been reminded my hatch ring is what I need to protect and therefore heating might not be a great idea. Steve On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 4:07 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Steve, That sounds like a bad idea, you could damage the dome with the heat. Can you slip a blade between the dome and seat? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 3:54 PM All, I am removing my old K-250 hatch dome. It looks like it has been installed with a product like Sikaflex (I'd guess). I would like to not destroy it if possible (or the hatch). It really doesn't want to come out. I am thinking about heating the hatch's metal ring where the dome is seated to maybe break down the sealant or soften the acrylic. I have a concern about the heat warping or otherwise affecting the metal of the hatch. Any input? Steve -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 16:44:22 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 15:44:22 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question Message-ID: <895xw6b37j6gviewojl5ry48.1423691062465@email.android.com> Steve, Where are you getting your new hatch from? Roughly how much will it cost? Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/11/2015 3:33 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question Hank, the dome has no life left so I can bust/cut it out with a hammer, drill or a chainsaw if needed. I tried the blade idea but not much luck. I only wanted to keep it in 1 piece as a reference for my new dome. It probably isn't needed even for that. I have been reminded my hatch ring is what I need to protect and therefore heating might not be a great idea. Steve On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 4:07 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Steve, That sounds like a bad idea, you could damage the dome with the heat. Can you slip a blade between the dome and seat? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 3:54 PM All, I am removing my old K-250 hatch dome. It looks like it has been installed with a product like Sikaflex (I'd guess). I would like to not destroy it if possible (or the hatch). It really doesn't want to come out. I am thinking about heating the hatch's metal ring where the dome is seated to maybe break down the sealant or soften the acrylic. I have a concern about the heat warping or otherwise affecting the metal of the hatch. Any input? Steve -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 17:19:41 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 14:19:41 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1423693181.75033.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Steve, In that case, I see a new saws all blade in your future :-) Hank -------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/11/15, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-250 Hatch Dome Removal Question To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Wednesday, February 11, 2015, 3:54 PM All, I am removing my old K-250 hatch dome.? It looks like it has been installed with a product like Sikaflex (I'd guess). ? I would like to not destroy it if possible (or the hatch).? It really doesn't want to come out. I am thinking about heating the hatch's metal ring where the dome is seated to maybe break down the sealant or soften the acrylic.? I have a concern about the heat warping or otherwise affecting the metal of the hatch. Any input? Steve -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 11 18:06:25 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 15:06:25 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] air over hydraulic Message-ID: <1423695985.75414.YahooMailBasic@web125405.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Scott, You could use air cylinders with solenoid air valves but run oil instead of air. Use a hp tank full of oil and use air pressure to push the oil out of the tank. That eliminates the hyd pump and motor. The oil would return to a transfer tank. It does not take a lot of oil to move a function and you can likely do your task without transferring the oil back to the pressure tank. Hmmm did I confuse you Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 13:43:16 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 10:43:16 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery Message-ID: <1423766596.33584.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> I have just dismantled a submersible well pump. As I thought it is fluid filled and all SS, it seems like it is filled with anti freeze not oil. This would make a beautiful thruster. The output shaft is splined and a simple adaptor to a prop and your done, also a thrust washer should go in. The armature rides on bushings, not bearings. The wires are potted and plug into the motor interior. This is very interesting and should be explored more. Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 14:46:21 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 14:46:21 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery In-Reply-To: <1423766596.33584.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423766596.33584.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <54DD030D.4010003@psubs.org> Voltage? On 2/12/2015 1:43 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > I have just dismantled a submersible well pump. As I thought it is fluid filled and all SS, it seems like it is filled with anti freeze not oil. This would make a beautiful thruster. The output shaft is splined and a simple adaptor to a prop and your done, also a thrust washer should go in. The armature rides on bushings, not bearings. The wires are potted and plug into the motor interior. This is very interesting and should be explored more. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 16:07:19 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 13:07:19 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery In-Reply-To: <54DD030D.4010003@psubs.org> Message-ID: <1423775239.60751.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Voltage is 220 AC buy it gets better! I discovered the bottom end of the motor has a very elaborate thrust assembly and a rubber bladder for pressure compensation. OMG just remove the armature and machine the spline off and screw a prop adaptor on and your done! Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 2:46 PM Voltage? On 2/12/2015 1:43 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > I have just dismantled a submersible well pump.? As I thought it is fluid filled and all SS, it seems like it is filled with anti freeze not oil.? This would make a beautiful thruster.? The output shaft is splined and a simple adaptor to a prop and your done, also a thrust washer should go in.? The armature rides on bushings, not bearings.? The wires are potted and plug into the motor interior. This is very interesting and should be explored more. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 16:35:54 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 21:35:54 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery In-Reply-To: <1423775239.60751.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423775239.60751.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1790944184.2444101.1423776954340.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Sounds interesting Hank,any pictures?You may be able to fit a frameless DC motor in it,or adapt it for DC. Is it brushless,?is there any gearing,& what horsepower? Oh yeah & what price???Cheers Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:07 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery Voltage is 220 AC? buy it gets better!? I discovered the bottom end of the motor has a very elaborate? thrust assembly and a rubber bladder for pressure compensation.? OMG? just remove the armature and machine the spline off and screw a prop adaptor on and your done!? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 2:46 PM Voltage? On 2/12/2015 1:43 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > I have just dismantled a submersible well pump.? As I thought it is fluid filled and all SS, it seems like it is filled with anti freeze not oil.? This would make a beautiful thruster.? The output shaft is splined and a simple adaptor to a prop and your done, also a thrust washer should go in.? The armature rides on bushings, not bearings.? The wires are potted and plug into the motor interior. This is very interesting and should be explored more. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 16:39:16 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 21:39:16 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery In-Reply-To: <1423775239.60751.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423775239.60751.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <626038478.2448533.1423777156390.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Meant to send this link to Parker Motion,frameless motor options.http://www.parkermotion.com/pdfs/bayside_cat/07%20Frameless%20Motors%20&%20Gearmotors.pdf Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:07 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery Voltage is 220 AC? buy it gets better!? I discovered the bottom end of the motor has a very elaborate? thrust assembly and a rubber bladder for pressure compensation.? OMG? just remove the armature and machine the spline off and screw a prop adaptor on and your done!? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 2:46 PM Voltage? On 2/12/2015 1:43 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > I have just dismantled a submersible well pump.? As I thought it is fluid filled and all SS, it seems like it is filled with anti freeze not oil.? This would make a beautiful thruster.? The output shaft is splined and a simple adaptor to a prop and your done, also a thrust washer should go in.? The armature rides on bushings, not bearings.? The wires are potted and plug into the motor interior. This is very interesting and should be explored more. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 16:52:46 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 13:52:46 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery In-Reply-To: <1790944184.2444101.1423776954340.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1423777966.89545.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Alan, Just talked to a buddy that installs these pumps. He said you can get many voltage and hp combinations and they are around 400 dollars. Also you can get a speed controller. No brushes, no pictures. :-) they are about 4.5 in dia and 2 feet long and shiny ss body. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 4:35 PM Sounds interesting Hank,any pictures?You may be able to fit a frameless DC motor in it,or adapt it for DC. Is it brushless,?is there any gearing,& what horsepower? Oh yeah & what price???Cheers Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:07 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery Voltage is 220 AC? buy it gets better!? I discovered the bottom end of the motor has a very elaborate? thrust assembly and a rubber bladder for pressure compensation.? OMG? just remove the armature and machine the spline off and screw a prop adaptor on and your done!? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 2:46 PM Voltage? On 2/12/2015 1:43 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > I have just dismantled a submersible well pump.? As I thought it is fluid filled and all SS, it seems like it is filled with anti freeze not oil.? This would make a beautiful thruster.? The output shaft is splined and a simple adaptor to a prop and your done, also a thrust washer should go in.? The armature rides on bushings, not bearings.? The wires are potted and plug into the motor interior. This is very interesting and should be explored more. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 16:56:44 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 13:56:44 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: HD Deep Well Pump 1 HP Stainless Steel Submersible Sump Pump 200ft 110v 33 gpm Message-ID: <1423778204.28398.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Alan , here is a 110v pump, looks the same as the one I have Hank --- On Thu, 2/12/15, hank pronk wrote: > From: hank pronk > Subject: HD Deep Well Pump 1 HP Stainless Steel Submersible Sump Pump 200ft 110v 33 gpm > To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" > Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 4:55 PM > > > > http://www.ebay.com/itm/HD-Deep-Well-Pump-1-HP-Stainless-Steel-Submersible-Sump-Pump-200ft-110v-33-gpm-/301176535526?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0 > > From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 16:58:32 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 21:58:32 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery In-Reply-To: <1423777966.89545.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423777966.89545.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2071408083.2453785.1423778312640.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Wow, sounds good.?What brand? any online links?Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:52 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery Alan, Just talked to a buddy that installs these pumps.? He said you can get many voltage and hp combinations and they are around 400 dollars.? Also you can get a speed controller.? No brushes, no pictures.? :-)? they are about 4.5 in dia and 2 feet long and shiny ss body. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 4:35 PM Sounds interesting Hank,any pictures?You may be able to fit a frameless DC motor in it,or adapt it for DC. Is it brushless,?is there any gearing,& what horsepower? Oh yeah & what price???Cheers Alan ? ? ? ? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:07 AM ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery ? ? Voltage is 220 AC? buy it gets better!? I discovered the bottom end of the motor has a very elaborate? thrust assembly and a rubber bladder for pressure compensation.? OMG? just remove the armature and machine the spline off and screw a prop adaptor on and your done!? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery ? To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ? Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 2:46 PM ? ? Voltage? ? ? ? On 2/12/2015 1:43 PM, hank pronk via ? Personal_Submersibles wrote: > I have ? just dismantled a submersible well pump.? As I thought it ? is fluid filled and all SS, it seems like it is filled with ? anti freeze not oil.? This would make a beautiful ? thruster.? The output shaft is splined and a simple adaptor ? to a prop and your done, also a thrust washer should go in.? The armature rides on bushings, not bearings.? The ? wires are potted and plug into the motor interior. This is ? very interesting and should be explored more. ? > Hank ? > _______________________________________________ ? > Personal_Submersibles mailing list ? > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ? > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ ? Personal_Submersibles mailing list ? Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ? http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 12 17:09:40 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 14:09:40 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery In-Reply-To: <2071408083.2453785.1423778312640.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1423778980.32361.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Alan, The one I have is similar but I don't know anything about it. I found it in the dump :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 4:58 PM Wow, sounds good.?What brand? any online links?Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:52 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery Alan, Just talked to a buddy that installs these pumps.? He said you can get many voltage and hp combinations and they are around 400 dollars.? Also you can get a speed controller.? No brushes, no pictures.? :-)? they are about 4.5 in dia and 2 feet long and shiny ss body. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 4:35 PM Sounds interesting Hank,any pictures?You may be able to fit a frameless DC motor in it,or adapt it for DC. Is it brushless,?is there any gearing,& what horsepower? Oh yeah & what price???Cheers Alan ? ? ? ? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 10:07 AM ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery ? ? Voltage is 220 AC? buy it gets better!? I discovered the bottom end of the motor has a very elaborate? thrust assembly and a rubber bladder for pressure compensation.? OMG? just remove the armature and machine the spline off and screw a prop adaptor on and your done!? Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/12/15, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ? Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] thruster discovery ? To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ? Received: Thursday, February 12, 2015, 2:46 PM ? ? Voltage? ? ? ? On 2/12/2015 1:43 PM, hank pronk via ? Personal_Submersibles wrote: > I have ? just dismantled a submersible well pump.? As I thought it ? is fluid filled and all SS, it seems like it is filled with ? anti freeze not oil.? This would make a beautiful ? thruster.? The output shaft is splined and a simple adaptor ? to a prop and your done, also a thrust washer should go in.? The armature rides on bushings, not bearings.? The ? wires are potted and plug into the motor interior. This is ? very interesting and should be explored more. ? > Hank ? > _______________________________________________ ? > Personal_Submersibles mailing list ? > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ? > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ ? Personal_Submersibles mailing list ? Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ? http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 13 01:22:47 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 19:22:47 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. Message-ID: <54dd9839.4169440a.2f8f.0b8b@mx.google.com> Hi All, I am having problems with Kelly controllers but need small footprint 2 kw 72 volt BLDC controllers. Any recommendations for reliable units? Hugh -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 13 03:29:33 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 08:29:33 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. In-Reply-To: <54dd9839.4169440a.2f8f.0b8b@mx.google.com> References: <54dd9839.4169440a.2f8f.0b8b@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> On the electronic speed controller subject Hugh; I have been reading aboutthe length of wires from the battery to the esc causing problems.too long battery wires will kill ESC over time: precautions, solutions & workarounds - RC Groups The long run of wires in a submarine would be particularly bad.I would be interested in any solution you may come across.Most of the RC escs only go up to 59V.?Castle creations sells motors up to 10,000 watts so should have escs that would cover your 72 volt requirement. Just can't see them advertised. You would need to enquire.I think they will taylor make components for you.http://www.castlecreations.com/index.html They have a reputation in the RC World of producing top of the line stuff.Alan ? From: Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles To: 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 7:22 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. Hi All, ?I am having problems with Kelly controllers but need small footprint 2 kw 72 volt BLDC controllers.Any recommendations for reliable units?Hugh ? __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11169 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 13 13:20:58 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (keith tollett via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 18:20:58 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. In-Reply-To: <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1216180235.2687608.1423851658808.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Have you given thought to using electric car controllers? Curtis makes them in voltages ranging from 24-170 volts and are made for large amperage draws. Keith On Friday, February 13, 2015 12:36 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: On the electronic speed controller subject Hugh; I have been reading aboutthe length of wires from the battery to the esc causing problems.too long battery wires will kill ESC over time: precautions, solutions & workarounds - RC Groups The long run of wires in a submarine would be particularly bad.I would be interested in any solution you may come across.Most of the RC escs only go up to 59V.?Castle creations sells motors up to 10,000 watts so should have escs that would cover your 72 volt requirement. Just can't see them advertised. You would need to enquire.I think they will taylor make components for you.http://www.castlecreations.com/index.html They have a reputation in the RC World of producing top of the line stuff.Alan ? From: Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles To: 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 7:22 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. #yiv2973736671 #yiv2973736671 -- filtered {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}#yiv2973736671 filtered {font-family:Tahoma;panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}#yiv2973736671 p.yiv2973736671MsoNormal, #yiv2973736671 li.yiv2973736671MsoNormal, #yiv2973736671 div.yiv2973736671MsoNormal {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:11.0pt;}#yiv2973736671 a:link, #yiv2973736671 span.yiv2973736671MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv2973736671 a:visited, #yiv2973736671 span.yiv2973736671MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv2973736671 p.yiv2973736671MsoAcetate, #yiv2973736671 li.yiv2973736671MsoAcetate, #yiv2973736671 div.yiv2973736671MsoAcetate {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:8.0pt;}#yiv2973736671 span.yiv2973736671EmailStyle17 {color:windowtext;}#yiv2973736671 span.yiv2973736671BalloonTextChar {}#yiv2973736671 .yiv2973736671MsoChpDefault {}#yiv2973736671 filtered {margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt;}#yiv2973736671 div.yiv2973736671WordSection1 {}#yiv2973736671 Hi All, ?I am having problems with Kelly controllers but need small footprint 2 kw 72 volt BLDC controllers.Any recommendations for reliable units?Hugh ? __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11169 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 13 17:27:05 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 11:27:05 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. In-Reply-To: <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <54dd9839.4169440a.2f8f.0b8b@mx.google.com> <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <54de7a2c.421b450a.6283.5d05@mx.google.com> Thanks Alan I will give it a try. Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Friday, 13 February 2015 9:30 p.m. To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. On the electronic speed controller subject Hugh; I have been reading about the length of wires from the battery to the esc causing problems. too long battery wires will kill ESC over time: precautions, solutions & workarounds - RC Groups The long run of wires in a submarine would be particularly bad. I would be interested in any solution you may come across. Most of the RC escs only go up to 59V. Castle creations sells motors up to 10,000 watts so should have escs that would cover your 72 volt requirement. Just can't see them advertised. You would need to enquire. I think they will taylor make components for you. http://www.castlecreations.com/index.html They have a reputation in the RC World of producing top of the line stuff. Alan _____ From: Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles To: 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 7:22 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. Hi All, I am having problems with Kelly controllers but need small footprint 2 kw 72 volt BLDC controllers. Any recommendations for reliable units? Hugh __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11169 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11169 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11173 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 13 17:38:32 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 11:38:32 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. In-Reply-To: <1216180235.2687608.1423851658808.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <1216180235.2687608.1423851658808.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <54de7cda.6786440a.48ee.57a7@mx.google.com> Thanks Keith, Have sent off an enquiry to Curtis. Regards, Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of keith tollett via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Saturday, 14 February 2015 7:21 a.m. To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. Have you given thought to using electric car controllers? Curtis makes them in voltages ranging from 24-170 volts and are made for large amperage draws. Keith On Friday, February 13, 2015 12:36 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: On the electronic speed controller subject Hugh; I have been reading about the length of wires from the battery to the esc causing problems. too long battery wires will kill ESC over time: precautions, solutions & workarounds - RC Groups The long run of wires in a submarine would be particularly bad. I would be interested in any solution you may come across. Most of the RC escs only go up to 59V. Castle creations sells motors up to 10,000 watts so should have escs that would cover your 72 volt requirement. Just can't see them advertised. You would need to enquire. I think they will taylor make components for you. http://www.castlecreations.com/index.html They have a reputation in the RC World of producing top of the line stuff. Alan _____ From: Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles To: 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 7:22 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. Hi All, I am having problems with Kelly controllers but need small footprint 2 kw 72 volt BLDC controllers. Any recommendations for reliable units? Hugh __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11169 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11172 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11173 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 14 18:49:19 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 15:49:19 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart Message-ID: <1423957759.29585.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> My launch cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the trailer and into the water. My modifications are nice also, remote steering and remote throttle are a dream. The 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive plane. The new lights are great except the front one needs adjusting. Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd years. I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and throw it into the water. When I head out for my dive it just unwinds itself as needed. No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 14 20:52:56 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 17:52:56 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: <1423957759.29585.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423957759.29585.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001001d048c2$1e7ae450$5b70acf0$@telus.net> Photos, Hank? We all need to vicariously enjoy you dives. Tim -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-14-15 3:49 PM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart My launch cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the trailer and into the water. My modifications are nice also, remote steering and remote throttle are a dream. The 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive plane. The new lights are great except the front one needs adjusting. Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd years. I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and throw it into the water. When I head out for my dive it just unwinds itself as needed. No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 14 21:01:48 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 18:01:48 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: <001001d048c2$1e7ae450$5b70acf0$@telus.net> Message-ID: <1423965708.80822.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Tim, Today was cold and windy, I was too pre occupied to take pictures. I am going to look for a group of rail cars in a couple of days. I will take pictures from that trip. I had my cell phone sitting in a port videoing and I went right over a fishing rod at 175 feet. Wish I saw it at the time, that could have been my salvage job with my cue ball arm. :-) Hank -------------------------------------------- On Sat, 2/14/15, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 8:52 PM Photos, Hank? We all need to vicariously enjoy you dives. Tim -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-14-15 3:49 PM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart My launch cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the trailer and into the water.? My modifications are nice also, remote steering and remote throttle are a dream.? The 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive plane.? The new lights are great except the front one needs adjusting.? Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd years. I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and throw it into the water.? When I head out for my dive it just unwinds itself as needed.? No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 14 21:03:33 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 18:03:33 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: <1423965708.80822.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1423965813.56583.YahooMailBasic@web125405.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Tim, I am trying to send you the video, its pretty neat. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Sat, 2/14/15, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 9:01 PM Tim, Today was cold and windy, I was too pre occupied to take pictures.? I am going to look for a group of rail cars in a couple of days.? I will take pictures from that trip.? I had my cell phone sitting in a port videoing and I went right over a fishing rod at 175 feet.? Wish I saw it at the time, that could have been my salvage job with my cue ball arm. :-) Hank? -------------------------------------------- On Sat, 2/14/15, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 8:52 PM Photos, Hank? We all need to vicariously enjoy you dives. Tim -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-14-15 3:49 PM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart My launch cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the trailer and into the water.? My modifications are nice also, remote steering and remote throttle are a dream.? The 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive plane.? The new lights are great except the front one needs adjusting.? Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd years. I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and throw it into the water.? When I head out for my dive it just unwinds itself as needed.? No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 14 21:17:16 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 18:17:16 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: <1423965708.80822.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <001001d048c2$1e7ae450$5b70acf0$@telus.net> <1423965708.80822.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001101d048c5$849fd990$8ddf8cb0$@telus.net> You could have told your wife that the sub is a great money maker, picking up the fishing rod. -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-14-15 6:02 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart Tim, Today was cold and windy, I was too pre occupied to take pictures. I am going to look for a group of rail cars in a couple of days. I will take pictures from that trip. I had my cell phone sitting in a port videoing and I went right over a fishing rod at 175 feet. Wish I saw it at the time, that could have been my salvage job with my cue ball arm. :-) Hank -------------------------------------------- On Sat, 2/14/15, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 8:52 PM Photos, Hank? We all need to vicariously enjoy you dives. Tim -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-14-15 3:49 PM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart My launch cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the trailer and into the water.? My modifications are nice also, remote steering and remote throttle are a dream.? The 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive plane.? The new lights are great except the front one needs adjusting.? Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd years. I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and throw it into the water.? When I head out for my dive it just unwinds itself as needed.? No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 14 21:23:33 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 21:23:33 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: <1423957759.29585.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423957759.29585.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: ...and it sounds like you've just been diving in Canada in February. That deserves a medal in itself! On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at 6:49 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > My launch cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the > trailer and into the water. My modifications are nice also, remote > steering and remote throttle are a dream. The 50 lb vertical thruster is a > huge improvement over the dive plane. The new lights are great except the > front one needs adjusting. Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd > years. I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, > now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto > the reel and throw it into the water. When I head out for my dive it just > unwinds itself as needed. No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 14 21:33:07 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 18:33:07 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1423967587.27954.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> yes ice bergs and all, well sheet ice :-)-------------------------------------------- On Sat, 2/14/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 9:23 PM ...and it sounds like you've just been diving in Canada in February. That deserves a medal in itself! On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at 6:49 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: My launch cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the trailer and into the water.? My modifications are nice also, remote steering and remote throttle are a dream.? The 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive plane.? The new lights are great except the front one needs adjusting.? Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd years.? I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and throw it into the water.? When I head out for my dive it just unwinds? itself as needed.? No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 14 22:43:31 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Private via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 22:43:31 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: <1423967587.27954.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1423967587.27954.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: We really need one of those "surfacing at the North Pole" shots Hank. Darn, and I think it's cold in my garage in Virginia. This must be the tropics by comparison and tonight it's 10F / -12C. > On Feb 14, 2015, at 9:33 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > yes ice bergs and all, well sheet ice :-)-------------------------------------------- > On Sat, 2/14/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" > Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 9:23 PM > > ...and it > sounds like you've just been diving in Canada in > February. That deserves a medal in itself! > On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at > 6:49 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > My launch > cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the > trailer and into the water. My modifications are nice > also, remote steering and remote throttle are a dream. The > 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive > plane. The new lights are great except the front one needs > adjusting. Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd > years. I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my > diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is > needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and throw it into > the water. When I head out for my dive it just unwinds > itself as needed. No more big tangled mess of rope in the > sub. > > Hank > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Feb 15 00:36:12 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 21:36:12 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: References: <1423967587.27954.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002001d048e1$4eec12c0$ecc43840$@telus.net> Not everywhere in Canada is cold. Certainly the east is getting hit hard, but over here on the Pacific south coast (Pacific north west for US folks) it's practically spring. Tomorrow's forecast for Vancouver BC is sunny and 52F/11C, lows of 35F/2C overnight. So far no real snow this year at all. Sea temperature 46F/8C (local lakes are colder but not by much). Dry suits are great but I still wish I was on Maui. Alan, how's your weather? -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of Private via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-14-15 7:44 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart We really need one of those "surfacing at the North Pole" shots Hank. Darn, and I think it's cold in my garage in Virginia. This must be the tropics by comparison and tonight it's 10F / -12C. > On Feb 14, 2015, at 9:33 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > yes ice bergs and all, well sheet ice > :-)-------------------------------------------- > On Sat, 2/14/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" > > Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 9:23 PM > > ...and it > sounds like you've just been diving in Canada in February. That > deserves a medal in itself! > On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at > 6:49 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > > wrote: > My launch > cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the trailer > and into the water. My modifications are nice also, remote steering > and remote throttle are a dream. The > 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive plane. > The new lights are great except the front one needs adjusting. Gamma > saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd years. I adapted a garden > hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 > feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and > throw it into the water. When I head out for my dive it just unwinds > itself as needed. No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. > > Hank > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Feb 15 01:55:59 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 22:55:59 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart Message-ID: <20150214225559.39F3A375@m0048136.ppops.net> I went sailing today out of Ventura, it was in the 80's and hardly any wind. Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: T Novak via Personal_Submersibles To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 21:36:12 -0800 Not everywhere in Canada is cold. Certainly the east is getting hit hard, but over here on the Pacific south coast (Pacific north west for US folks) it's practically spring. Tomorrow's forecast for Vancouver BC is sunny and 52F/11C, lows of 35F/2C overnight. So far no real snow this year at all. Sea temperature 46F/8C (local lakes are colder but not by much). Dry suits are great but I still wish I was on Maui. Alan, how's your weather? -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of Private via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-14-15 7:44 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart We really need one of those "surfacing at the North Pole" shots Hank. Darn, and I think it's cold in my garage in Virginia. This must be the tropics by comparison and tonight it's 10F / -12C. > On Feb 14, 2015, at 9:33 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > yes ice bergs and all, well sheet ice > :-)-------------------------------------------- > On Sat, 2/14/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" > > Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 9:23 PM > > ...and it > sounds like you've just been diving in Canada in February. That > deserves a medal in itself! > On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at > 6:49 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > > wrote: > My launch > cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the trailer > and into the water. My modifications are nice also, remote steering > and remote throttle are a dream. The > 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive plane. > The new lights are great except the front one needs adjusting. Gamma > saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd years. I adapted a garden > hose reel to the bottom of my diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 > feet or what ever is needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and > throw it into the water. When I head out for my dive it just unwinds > itself as needed. No more big tangled mess of rope in the sub. > > Hank > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Feb 15 08:02:53 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2015 05:02:53 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1424005373.24198.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Alec, Tim is right, we are having a great winter. It was +3C when I got to the lake but the wind made it real harsh. I was toasty warm in he sub with my old school steampunk interior lights burning up amps to give me heat. The wind blew the last of the ice off also. You need to get some insulation and a furnace for that garage or do like Alan and convert part of your house to a sub shop. :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Sat, 2/14/15, Private via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 10:43 PM We really need one of those "surfacing at the North Pole" shots Hank. Darn, and I think it's cold in my garage in Virginia. This must be the tropics by comparison and tonight it's 10F / -12C. > On Feb 14, 2015, at 9:33 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > yes ice bergs and all, well sheet ice :-)-------------------------------------------- > On Sat, 2/14/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] launch cart > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" > Received: Saturday, February 14, 2015, 9:23 PM > > ...and it > sounds like you've just been diving in Canada in > February. That deserves a medal in itself! > On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at > 6:49 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > My launch > cart works terrific, sure draws a crowd when I drive off the > trailer and into the water.? My modifications are nice > also, remote steering and remote throttle are a dream.? The > 50 lb vertical thruster is a huge improvement over the dive > plane.? The new lights are great except the front one needs > adjusting.? Gamma saw 175 feet for the first time in 20 odd > years.? I adapted a garden hose reel to the bottom of my > diver below buoy, now I just wrap 200 feet or what ever is > needed length of nylon rope onto the reel and throw it into > the water.? When I head out for my dive it just unwinds > itself as needed.? No more big tangled mess of rope in the > sub. > > Hank > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Feb 15 13:04:28 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2015 10:04:28 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] compensation problems Message-ID: <1424023468.57204.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Every time I take Gamma out to any real depth, I loose oil from my prop shaft. The magnetic coupler swims in oil with a shaft bearing in oil then a seal to keep the oil in. The seal never leaks just sitting around. I have tried a couple of different compensation methods, a squeeze ball, an bicycle tube. I am positive all the air is out of the system. Is my compensation bladder area to large? Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 16 06:05:58 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2015 11:05:58 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. In-Reply-To: <54de7cda.6786440a.48ee.57a7@mx.google.com> References: <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <1216180235.2687608.1423851658808.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <54de7cda.6786440a.48ee.57a7@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hi all. I have a contact for a guy who makes custom motor controllers. He mainly makes them for electric bikes and RC stuff, but he can do pretty much anything you want. Custom made to your spec and they are cheap. I have 3 of his controllers custom made to my spec for my electric bikes. 50vdc 150amp nominal discharge rate with 300 amp peak. They have been really good. Contact me off list if anyone is interested. Of course they are not waterproof. Regards James On 13 February 2015 at 22:38, Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Thanks Keith, Have sent off an enquiry to Curtis. > > > > Regards, Hugh > > *From:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto: > personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] *On Behalf Of *keith tollett via > Personal_Submersibles > *Sent:* Saturday, 14 February 2015 7:21 a.m. > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. > > > > Have you given thought to using electric car controllers? Curtis makes > them in voltages ranging from 24-170 volts and are made for large amperage > draws. > > > > Keith > > > > On Friday, February 13, 2015 12:36 AM, Alan James via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > > On the electronic speed controller subject Hugh; I have been reading about > > the length of wires from the battery to the esc causing problems. > > too long battery wires will kill ESC over time: precautions, solutions & > workarounds - RC Groups > > > The long run of wires in a submarine would be particularly bad. > > I would be interested in any solution you may come across. > > Most of the RC escs only go up to 59V. > > Castle creations sells motors up to 10,000 watts so should have escs that > would > > cover your 72 volt requirement. Just can't see them advertised. You would > need to enquire. > > I think they will taylor make components for you. > > http://www.castlecreations.com/index.html > > They have a reputation in the RC World of producing top of the line stuff. > > Alan > > > > > ------------------------------ > > *From:* Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *To:* 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *Sent:* Friday, February 13, 2015 7:22 PM > *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. > > > > Hi All, > > > > I am having problems with Kelly controllers but need small footprint 2 kw > 72 volt BLDC controllers. > > Any recommendations for reliable units? > > Hugh > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11169 (20150213) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11172 (20150213) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11173 (20150213) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11173 (20150213) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 16 14:31:09 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2015 08:31:09 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. In-Reply-To: References: <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <1216180235.2687608.1423851658808.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <54de7cda.6786440a.48ee.57a7@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <54e24561.a5d3440a.0537.ffffa75e@mx.google.com> Hi James, I would really like to follow up on this. What is your email. Thks, Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Tuesday, 17 February 2015 12:06 a.m. To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. Hi all. I have a contact for a guy who makes custom motor controllers. He mainly makes them for electric bikes and RC stuff, but he can do pretty much anything you want. Custom made to your spec and they are cheap. I have 3 of his controllers custom made to my spec for my electric bikes. 50vdc 150amp nominal discharge rate with 300 amp peak. They have been really good. Contact me off list if anyone is interested. Of course they are not waterproof. Regards James On 13 February 2015 at 22:38, Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks Keith, Have sent off an enquiry to Curtis. Regards, Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of keith tollett via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Saturday, 14 February 2015 7:21 a.m. To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. Have you given thought to using electric car controllers? Curtis makes them in voltages ranging from 24-170 volts and are made for large amperage draws. Keith On Friday, February 13, 2015 12:36 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: On the electronic speed controller subject Hugh; I have been reading about the length of wires from the battery to the esc causing problems. too long battery wires will kill ESC over time: precautions, solutions & workarounds - RC Groups The long run of wires in a submarine would be particularly bad. I would be interested in any solution you may come across. Most of the RC escs only go up to 59V. Castle creations sells motors up to 10,000 watts so should have escs that would cover your 72 volt requirement. Just can't see them advertised. You would need to enquire. I think they will taylor make components for you. http://www.castlecreations.com/index.html They have a reputation in the RC World of producing top of the line stuff. Alan _____ From: Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles To: 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' Sent: Friday, February 13, 2015 7:22 PM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. Hi All, I am having problems with Kelly controllers but need small footprint 2 kw 72 volt BLDC controllers. Any recommendations for reliable units? Hugh __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11169 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11172 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11173 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11173 (20150213) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 11182 (20150216) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 17 06:04:09 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2015 11:04:09 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. In-Reply-To: <54e24561.a5d3440a.0537.ffffa75e@mx.google.com> References: <1213049783.2563232.1423816173778.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <1216180235.2687608.1423851658808.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <54de7cda.6786440a.48ee.57a7@mx.google.com> <54e24561.a5d3440a.0537.ffffa75e@mx.google.com> Message-ID: jamesf at Guernseysubmarine.com On 16 February 2015 at 19:31, Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi James, > > I would really like to follow up on this. What is your email. > > Thks, Hugh > > > > *From:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto: > personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] *On Behalf Of *James Frankland > via Personal_Submersibles > *Sent:* Tuesday, 17 February 2015 12:06 a.m. > > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. > > > > Hi all. > > I have a contact for a guy who makes custom motor controllers. He mainly > makes them for electric bikes and RC stuff, but he can do pretty much > anything you want. Custom made to your spec and they are cheap. > > > > I have 3 of his controllers custom made to my spec for my electric bikes. > 50vdc 150amp nominal discharge rate with 300 amp peak. They have been > really good. Contact me off list if anyone is interested. Of course they > are not waterproof. > > > > Regards > > James > > > > On 13 February 2015 at 22:38, Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Thanks Keith, Have sent off an enquiry to Curtis. > > > > Regards, Hugh > > *From:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto: > personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] *On Behalf Of *keith tollett via > Personal_Submersibles > *Sent:* Saturday, 14 February 2015 7:21 a.m. > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. > > > > Have you given thought to using electric car controllers? Curtis makes > them in voltages ranging from 24-170 volts and are made for large amperage > draws. > > > > Keith > > > > On Friday, February 13, 2015 12:36 AM, Alan James via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > > On the electronic speed controller subject Hugh; I have been reading about > > the length of wires from the battery to the esc causing problems. > > too long battery wires will kill ESC over time: precautions, solutions & > workarounds - RC Groups > > > The long run of wires in a submarine would be particularly bad. > > I would be interested in any solution you may come across. > > Most of the RC escs only go up to 59V. > > Castle creations sells motors up to 10,000 watts so should have escs that > would > > cover your 72 volt requirement. Just can't see them advertised. You would > need to enquire. > > I think they will taylor make components for you. > > http://www.castlecreations.com/index.html > > They have a reputation in the RC World of producing top of the line stuff. > > Alan > > > > > ------------------------------ > > *From:* Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *To:* 'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *Sent:* Friday, February 13, 2015 7:22 PM > *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Controllers. > > > > Hi All, > > > > I am having problems with Kelly controllers but need small footprint 2 kw > 72 volt BLDC controllers. > > Any recommendations for reliable units? > > Hugh > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11169 (20150213) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11172 (20150213) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11173 (20150213) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11173 (20150213) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11182 (20150216) __________ > > > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 11184 (20150216) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 18 02:10:57 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Emile van Essen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 08:10:57 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] compensation problems In-Reply-To: <1424023468.57204.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Sloshing of the oil can create gas and thus overpressure. Can that be a cause? Emile -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: zondag 15 februari 2015 19:04 Aan: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] compensation problems Every time I take Gamma out to any real depth, I loose oil from my prop shaft. The magnetic coupler swims in oil with a shaft bearing in oil then a seal to keep the oil in. The seal never leaks just sitting around. I have tried a couple of different compensation methods, a squeeze ball, an bicycle tube. I am positive all the air is out of the system. Is my compensation bladder area to large? Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 18 08:26:39 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 05:26:39 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] compensation problems In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1424265999.52283.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Maybe the rotating shaft is causing overpressure, you might be on to something here! Hank-------------------------------------------- On Wed, 2/18/15, Emile van Essen via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] compensation problems To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" Received: Wednesday, February 18, 2015, 2:10 AM Sloshing of the oil can create gas and thus overpressure. Can that be a cause? Emile -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: zondag 15 februari 2015 19:04 Aan: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] compensation problems Every time I take Gamma out to any real depth, I loose oil from my prop shaft.? The magnetic coupler swims in oil with a shaft bearing in oil then a seal to keep the oil in.? The seal never leaks just sitting around.? I have tried a couple of different compensation methods, a squeeze ball, an bicycle tube.? I am positive all the air is out of the system.? Is my compensation bladder area to large? Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 18 11:26:10 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 08:26:10 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] O ring madness Message-ID: <20150218082610.39DFBD55@m0005312.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 18 13:29:50 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (glen brown via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 20:29:50 +0200 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] O ring madness In-Reply-To: <20150218082610.39DFBD55@m0005312.ppops.net> References: <20150218082610.39DFBD55@m0005312.ppops.net> Message-ID: Thanks Brian. Glen On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 6:26 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > I finally got my hatch back from the machine shop with the o ring groove > put in it. I had picked up the o ring a couple months earlier ( a 19" > diameter o ring. To my surprise the o ring was too big ! I figured > someone simply grabbed the wrong size of the shelf . Anyway , to make a > long story short, after contacting Parker I learned I was not inserting the > o ring correctly and that was why I had extra o ring at the end to pushing > it in. The correct way is to push in at 12 o'clock and 6 o'clock and then > at 3 and 9, and then keep doing that at 180 degrees until the o ring is > in. I'm sure a lot of you may know this already, but for those who > don't - some info on o rings ! > > Brian > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Feb 18 14:02:29 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 19:02:29 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] O ring madness In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <361853093.827461.1424286149627.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Thanks Brian,no didn't know that. Will come in handy when I have todo the hatch o-ring.Alan From: glen brown via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2015 7:29 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] O ring madness Thanks Brian.Glen On Wed, Feb 18, 2015 at 6:26 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: I finally got my hatch back from the machine shop with the o ring groove put in it.?? I had picked up the o ring a couple months earlier ( a 19" diameter o ring.? To my surprise the o ring was too big !? I figured someone simply grabbed the wrong size of the shelf?.?? Anyway , to make a long story short, after contacting Parker I learned I was not inserting the o ring correctly and that was why I had extra o ring at the end to pushing it in.? The correct way is to push in at 12 o'clock and 6 o'clock and then at 3 and 9, and then keep doing that at 180 degrees until the o ring is in.??? I'm sure a lot of you may know this already, but for those who don't? - some info on o rings !?Brian _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 19 05:28:16 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Emile van Essen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 11:28:16 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Andre, Looks good. For strength you might need a 25-30 mm thick nozzle. With the existing tooling I can produce domes : -Max height : 300 mm -OD. 610 mm -Minimal thickness (Apex) 26 mm - Machined edge and annealed. Regards, Emile _____ Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Andr? Eriksen via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: vrijdag 30 januari 2015 17:42 Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub Hi guys! Finally I can start building. Just rented a nice location outside town. This is the drawing of the sub. I want to have 400meters (1300ft) of max operating depth. The hull is 10mm (3/8") S355J2 steel. The ABS hull calculator is giving me 431,8m (1417ft) of depth, and 638,4m (2094ft) crush depth. Still have som FEA to do. Have to learn to use a new software since Autodesk Inventor don`t simulate buckling. Any thoughts on the design? Do someone want to confirm my calculations? Very excited to get started! Sorry for the metric dimensions for you who are not custom to them. I had a hard time figuring out the conning tower. I wanted it to go in one piece, but I want all the freeboard I can get and not get it too top heavy. Was thinking about going 20mm thick nozzle all the way up, but thinking I might get in trouble welding in the hatch seat ring. With 30mm I could do without welding in a seat ring, but it would be too top heavy. So decided to go with the Kittredge design, any thoughts on this? Domes in top and front and saddle tanks. Emile: If you still want to press domes for me, can you give me the exact measurements I should have for the bow ring? -Andr? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image002.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 24356 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 19 05:48:01 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Anders Ljung via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 11:48:01 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub In-Reply-To: References: <1422711784.30543.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hello I built and operated the submarine Malen and used it in the baltic sea. This boat was 10 tons and 10.5 meters long and had some 1+ meter freeboard. Still there where times when i got alot of the baltic sea in my head when driving surfaced. High freeboard is esential if operating in open sea. I would also recomend some kind of combustion engine onboard if operating in the sea , to battle waves and current some 2-3 kw per ton is nice to have A small marine diesel is a fantastic resource to have onboard plus its more fun and ads to the design challenge. If operating in the sea the boat will run the best with main ballast tanks mounted fore and aft according to my experiance. However these are my personal opinions and they might be completly wrong :) Anders Ljung 2015-02-02 21:55 GMT+01:00 Andr? Eriksen : > Thank you for the input Alec. > > I got a quote some time ago on the hemispheres.. around 1800 USD for the > both. > > Have had the concern of distorted visibility with the acrylic dome, but > thought it would be allright since I never have heard complaints on it. I > might look into going with a taller tower and flat viewports. More > freeboard and better visibility quality is not a bad thing. My center of > gravity and bouyancy calculations show I have some flexibilty there. > > Andr? > > > > 2015-01-31 14:43 GMT+01:00 hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org>: > >> Andre, >> I have a sub with an acrylic cylinder for the CT and the visibility is >> fantastic, >> Hank >> -------------------------------------------- >> On Fri, 1/30/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub >> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >> Received: Friday, January 30, 2015, 10:27 PM >> >> Hi >> Andre, >> Very nice drawing and >> concept, I like the simplicity and it looks balanced. I >> would have the following observations: >> - Check that you can actually get >> those hemispherical heads for a reasonable price. >> Hemispherical heads are far less common than elliptical. I >> was once shopping for endcaps and got the following quote: >> "The elliptical is $300, the hemispherical is $300 plus >> $4000 in tooling setup costs". >> - Regarding the coning tower design >> (K250 in this case) it depends what you want the sub for. >> The problem with that tower is the low freeboard, which is >> fine for lakes but insufficient for open water. You cannot >> open a K250 hatch in the ocean in anything but flat calm >> conditions. Also, visibility out of a K250 dome hatch is not >> good, even though that might sound counter-intuitive. You >> are looking through the side of a dome, which means poor >> optics. The bow dome visibility will be wonderful, because >> you're looking through the apex. Or, of course, >> visibility of the surface will be good from the >> coning tower, but one only uses that upon >> surfacing. >> - I would >> not worry too much about the boat being top heavy. In >> general, between low drop weights, low batteries, and high >> MBTs these little boats are extremely stable. You should be >> able to carry a significantly taller tower than that one >> given the hull beneath it. I'm not saying you should >> skip the stability calculations, I'm just saying I think >> you will find that the calculations prove you can carry a >> higher tower that will allow for flat viewports and increase >> freeboard. Another option is to put a cylindrical viewport >> on the K250 tower to bump it up. I haven't done that >> myself, but it could be done. >> Best, >> Alec >> On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at >> 11:42 AM, Andr? Eriksen >> wrote: >> Hi >> guys! >> Finally I can >> start building. Just rented a nice location outside town. >> This is the drawing of the sub. I want to have 400meters >> (1300ft) of max operating depth. The hull is 10mm >> (3/8") S355J2 steel. The ABS hull calculator is giving >> me 431,8m (1417ft) of depth, and 638,4m (2094ft) crush >> depth. Still have som FEA to do. Have to learn to use a new >> software since Autodesk Inventor don`t simulate buckling. >> Any thoughts on the design?Do someone want to >> confirm my calculations?Very excited to get >> started!Sorry for the metric dimensions for you >> who are not custom to them. >> I had a hard time figuring out the >> conning tower. I wanted it to go in one piece, but I want >> all the freeboard I can get and not get it too top heavy. >> Was thinking about going 20mm thick nozzle all the way up, >> but thinking I might get in trouble welding in the hatch >> seat ring. With 30mm I could do without welding in a seat >> ring, but it would be too top heavy. So decided to go with >> the Kittredge design, any thoughts on this? >> Domes in top and front and saddle >> tanks. >> Emile: >> If you still want to press domes for me, can you give me the >> exact measurements I should have for the bow >> ring? >> -Andr? >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> >> >> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> > > > > -- > Med Vennlig Hilsen / Regards > *Andr? Eriksen* > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 19 10:28:14 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (=?UTF-8?Q?Andr=C3=A9_Eriksen?= via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 16:28:14 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub In-Reply-To: References: <1422711784.30543.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Emile My FEA analysis shows that you are right, I have already upgraded the nozzle thickness. Anders Thanks for good advice. Don`t have the room for a diesel. Would be fun to have a look on your sub, it`s not a long drive from Norway. 2015-02-19 11:48 GMT+01.00, Anders Ljung via Personal_Submersibles : > Hello > > I built and operated the submarine Malen and used it in the baltic sea. > This boat was 10 tons and 10.5 meters long and had some 1+ meter freeboard. > Still there where times when i got alot of the baltic sea in my head when > driving surfaced. High freeboard is esential if operating in open sea. > I would also recomend some kind of combustion engine onboard if operating > in the sea , to battle waves and current some 2-3 kw per ton is nice to > have > A small marine diesel is a fantastic resource to have onboard plus its more > fun and ads to the design challenge. If operating in the sea the boat will > run the best > with main ballast tanks mounted fore and aft according to my experiance. > However these are my personal opinions and they might be completly wrong :) > > Anders Ljung > > 2015-02-02 21:55 GMT+01:00 Andr? Eriksen : > >> Thank you for the input Alec. >> >> I got a quote some time ago on the hemispheres.. around 1800 USD for the >> both. >> >> Have had the concern of distorted visibility with the acrylic dome, but >> thought it would be allright since I never have heard complaints on it. I >> might look into going with a taller tower and flat viewports. More >> freeboard and better visibility quality is not a bad thing. My center of >> gravity and bouyancy calculations show I have some flexibilty there. >> >> Andr? >> >> >> >> 2015-01-31 14:43 GMT+01:00 hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>: >> >>> Andre, >>> I have a sub with an acrylic cylinder for the CT and the visibility is >>> fantastic, >>> Hank >>> -------------------------------------------- >>> On Fri, 1/30/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub >>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>> Received: Friday, January 30, 2015, 10:27 PM >>> >>> Hi >>> Andre, >>> Very nice drawing and >>> concept, I like the simplicity and it looks balanced. I >>> would have the following observations: >>> - Check that you can actually get >>> those hemispherical heads for a reasonable price. >>> Hemispherical heads are far less common than elliptical. I >>> was once shopping for endcaps and got the following quote: >>> "The elliptical is $300, the hemispherical is $300 plus >>> $4000 in tooling setup costs". >>> - Regarding the coning tower design >>> (K250 in this case) it depends what you want the sub for. >>> The problem with that tower is the low freeboard, which is >>> fine for lakes but insufficient for open water. You cannot >>> open a K250 hatch in the ocean in anything but flat calm >>> conditions. Also, visibility out of a K250 dome hatch is not >>> good, even though that might sound counter-intuitive. You >>> are looking through the side of a dome, which means poor >>> optics. The bow dome visibility will be wonderful, because >>> you're looking through the apex. Or, of course, >>> visibility of the surface will be good from the >>> coning tower, but one only uses that upon >>> surfacing. >>> - I would >>> not worry too much about the boat being top heavy. In >>> general, between low drop weights, low batteries, and high >>> MBTs these little boats are extremely stable. You should be >>> able to carry a significantly taller tower than that one >>> given the hull beneath it. I'm not saying you should >>> skip the stability calculations, I'm just saying I think >>> you will find that the calculations prove you can carry a >>> higher tower that will allow for flat viewports and increase >>> freeboard. Another option is to put a cylindrical viewport >>> on the K250 tower to bump it up. I haven't done that >>> myself, but it could be done. >>> Best, >>> Alec >>> On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at >>> 11:42 AM, Andr? Eriksen >>> wrote: >>> Hi >>> guys! >>> Finally I can >>> start building. Just rented a nice location outside town. >>> This is the drawing of the sub. I want to have 400meters >>> (1300ft) of max operating depth. The hull is 10mm >>> (3/8") S355J2 steel. The ABS hull calculator is giving >>> me 431,8m (1417ft) of depth, and 638,4m (2094ft) crush >>> depth. Still have som FEA to do. Have to learn to use a new >>> software since Autodesk Inventor don`t simulate buckling. >>> Any thoughts on the design?Do someone want to >>> confirm my calculations?Very excited to get >>> started!Sorry for the metric dimensions for you >>> who are not custom to them. >>> I had a hard time figuring out the >>> conning tower. I wanted it to go in one piece, but I want >>> all the freeboard I can get and not get it too top heavy. >>> Was thinking about going 20mm thick nozzle all the way up, >>> but thinking I might get in trouble welding in the hatch >>> seat ring. With 30mm I could do without welding in a seat >>> ring, but it would be too top heavy. So decided to go with >>> the Kittredge design, any thoughts on this? >>> Domes in top and front and saddle >>> tanks. >>> Emile: >>> If you still want to press domes for me, can you give me the >>> exact measurements I should have for the bow >>> ring? >>> -Andr? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Med Vennlig Hilsen / Regards >> *Andr? Eriksen* >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > -- Med Vennlig Hilsen / Regards *Andr? Eriksen* From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 19 10:43:27 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (=?UTF-8?Q?H=C3=A5vard_Hardy?= via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 16:43:27 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub In-Reply-To: References: <1422711784.30543.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Andre. your drawing looks great! hope you post pictures when you start building. May i ask which company that rolls the steel for you? :) H?vard. 2015-02-19 16:28 GMT+01:00 Andr? Eriksen : > Emile > > My FEA analysis shows that you are right, I have already upgraded the > nozzle thickness. > > Anders > > Thanks for good advice. Don`t have the room for a diesel. Would be fun > to have a look on your sub, it`s not a long drive from Norway. > > 2015-02-19 11:48 GMT+01.00, Anders Ljung via Personal_Submersibles > : > > Hello > > > > I built and operated the submarine Malen and used it in the baltic sea. > > This boat was 10 tons and 10.5 meters long and had some 1+ meter > freeboard. > > Still there where times when i got alot of the baltic sea in my head when > > driving surfaced. High freeboard is esential if operating in open sea. > > I would also recomend some kind of combustion engine onboard if operating > > in the sea , to battle waves and current some 2-3 kw per ton is nice to > > have > > A small marine diesel is a fantastic resource to have onboard plus its > more > > fun and ads to the design challenge. If operating in the sea the boat > will > > run the best > > with main ballast tanks mounted fore and aft according to my experiance. > > However these are my personal opinions and they might be completly wrong > :) > > > > Anders Ljung > > > > 2015-02-02 21:55 GMT+01:00 Andr? Eriksen < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org>: > > > >> Thank you for the input Alec. > >> > >> I got a quote some time ago on the hemispheres.. around 1800 USD for the > >> both. > >> > >> Have had the concern of distorted visibility with the acrylic dome, but > >> thought it would be allright since I never have heard complaints on it. > I > >> might look into going with a taller tower and flat viewports. More > >> freeboard and better visibility quality is not a bad thing. My center of > >> gravity and bouyancy calculations show I have some flexibilty there. > >> > >> Andr? > >> > >> > >> > >> 2015-01-31 14:43 GMT+01:00 hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>: > >> > >>> Andre, > >>> I have a sub with an acrylic cylinder for the CT and the visibility is > >>> fantastic, > >>> Hank > >>> -------------------------------------------- > >>> On Fri, 1/30/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >>> > >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub > >>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > >>> Received: Friday, January 30, 2015, 10:27 PM > >>> > >>> Hi > >>> Andre, > >>> Very nice drawing and > >>> concept, I like the simplicity and it looks balanced. I > >>> would have the following observations: > >>> - Check that you can actually get > >>> those hemispherical heads for a reasonable price. > >>> Hemispherical heads are far less common than elliptical. I > >>> was once shopping for endcaps and got the following quote: > >>> "The elliptical is $300, the hemispherical is $300 plus > >>> $4000 in tooling setup costs". > >>> - Regarding the coning tower design > >>> (K250 in this case) it depends what you want the sub for. > >>> The problem with that tower is the low freeboard, which is > >>> fine for lakes but insufficient for open water. You cannot > >>> open a K250 hatch in the ocean in anything but flat calm > >>> conditions. Also, visibility out of a K250 dome hatch is not > >>> good, even though that might sound counter-intuitive. You > >>> are looking through the side of a dome, which means poor > >>> optics. The bow dome visibility will be wonderful, because > >>> you're looking through the apex. Or, of course, > >>> visibility of the surface will be good from the > >>> coning tower, but one only uses that upon > >>> surfacing. > >>> - I would > >>> not worry too much about the boat being top heavy. In > >>> general, between low drop weights, low batteries, and high > >>> MBTs these little boats are extremely stable. You should be > >>> able to carry a significantly taller tower than that one > >>> given the hull beneath it. I'm not saying you should > >>> skip the stability calculations, I'm just saying I think > >>> you will find that the calculations prove you can carry a > >>> higher tower that will allow for flat viewports and increase > >>> freeboard. Another option is to put a cylindrical viewport > >>> on the K250 tower to bump it up. I haven't done that > >>> myself, but it could be done. > >>> Best, > >>> Alec > >>> On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at > >>> 11:42 AM, Andr? Eriksen > >>> wrote: > >>> Hi > >>> guys! > >>> Finally I can > >>> start building. Just rented a nice location outside town. > >>> This is the drawing of the sub. I want to have 400meters > >>> (1300ft) of max operating depth. The hull is 10mm > >>> (3/8") S355J2 steel. The ABS hull calculator is giving > >>> me 431,8m (1417ft) of depth, and 638,4m (2094ft) crush > >>> depth. Still have som FEA to do. Have to learn to use a new > >>> software since Autodesk Inventor don`t simulate buckling. > >>> Any thoughts on the design?Do someone want to > >>> confirm my calculations?Very excited to get > >>> started!Sorry for the metric dimensions for you > >>> who are not custom to them. > >>> I had a hard time figuring out the > >>> conning tower. I wanted it to go in one piece, but I want > >>> all the freeboard I can get and not get it too top heavy. > >>> Was thinking about going 20mm thick nozzle all the way up, > >>> but thinking I might get in trouble welding in the hatch > >>> seat ring. With 30mm I could do without welding in a seat > >>> ring, but it would be too top heavy. So decided to go with > >>> the Kittredge design, any thoughts on this? > >>> Domes in top and front and saddle > >>> tanks. > >>> Emile: > >>> If you still want to press domes for me, can you give me the > >>> exact measurements I should have for the bow > >>> ring? > >>> -Andr? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >>> > >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >>> > >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Med Vennlig Hilsen / Regards > >> *Andr? Eriksen* > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >> > >> > > > > > -- > Med Vennlig Hilsen / Regards > *Andr? Eriksen* > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 19 11:10:56 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Anders Ljung via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 17:10:56 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub In-Reply-To: References: <1422711784.30543.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Build it longer !! hehe 2015-02-19 16:28 GMT+01:00 Andr? Eriksen : > Emile > > My FEA analysis shows that you are right, I have already upgraded the > nozzle thickness. > > Anders > > Thanks for good advice. Don`t have the room for a diesel. Would be fun > to have a look on your sub, it`s not a long drive from Norway. > > 2015-02-19 11:48 GMT+01.00, Anders Ljung via Personal_Submersibles > : > > Hello > > > > I built and operated the submarine Malen and used it in the baltic sea. > > This boat was 10 tons and 10.5 meters long and had some 1+ meter > freeboard. > > Still there where times when i got alot of the baltic sea in my head when > > driving surfaced. High freeboard is esential if operating in open sea. > > I would also recomend some kind of combustion engine onboard if operating > > in the sea , to battle waves and current some 2-3 kw per ton is nice to > > have > > A small marine diesel is a fantastic resource to have onboard plus its > more > > fun and ads to the design challenge. If operating in the sea the boat > will > > run the best > > with main ballast tanks mounted fore and aft according to my experiance. > > However these are my personal opinions and they might be completly wrong > :) > > > > Anders Ljung > > > > 2015-02-02 21:55 GMT+01:00 Andr? Eriksen < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org>: > > > >> Thank you for the input Alec. > >> > >> I got a quote some time ago on the hemispheres.. around 1800 USD for the > >> both. > >> > >> Have had the concern of distorted visibility with the acrylic dome, but > >> thought it would be allright since I never have heard complaints on it. > I > >> might look into going with a taller tower and flat viewports. More > >> freeboard and better visibility quality is not a bad thing. My center of > >> gravity and bouyancy calculations show I have some flexibilty there. > >> > >> Andr? > >> > >> > >> > >> 2015-01-31 14:43 GMT+01:00 hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>: > >> > >>> Andre, > >>> I have a sub with an acrylic cylinder for the CT and the visibility is > >>> fantastic, > >>> Hank > >>> -------------------------------------------- > >>> On Fri, 1/30/15, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >>> > >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Drawing of my 2-man sub > >>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > >>> Received: Friday, January 30, 2015, 10:27 PM > >>> > >>> Hi > >>> Andre, > >>> Very nice drawing and > >>> concept, I like the simplicity and it looks balanced. I > >>> would have the following observations: > >>> - Check that you can actually get > >>> those hemispherical heads for a reasonable price. > >>> Hemispherical heads are far less common than elliptical. I > >>> was once shopping for endcaps and got the following quote: > >>> "The elliptical is $300, the hemispherical is $300 plus > >>> $4000 in tooling setup costs". > >>> - Regarding the coning tower design > >>> (K250 in this case) it depends what you want the sub for. > >>> The problem with that tower is the low freeboard, which is > >>> fine for lakes but insufficient for open water. You cannot > >>> open a K250 hatch in the ocean in anything but flat calm > >>> conditions. Also, visibility out of a K250 dome hatch is not > >>> good, even though that might sound counter-intuitive. You > >>> are looking through the side of a dome, which means poor > >>> optics. The bow dome visibility will be wonderful, because > >>> you're looking through the apex. Or, of course, > >>> visibility of the surface will be good from the > >>> coning tower, but one only uses that upon > >>> surfacing. > >>> - I would > >>> not worry too much about the boat being top heavy. In > >>> general, between low drop weights, low batteries, and high > >>> MBTs these little boats are extremely stable. You should be > >>> able to carry a significantly taller tower than that one > >>> given the hull beneath it. I'm not saying you should > >>> skip the stability calculations, I'm just saying I think > >>> you will find that the calculations prove you can carry a > >>> higher tower that will allow for flat viewports and increase > >>> freeboard. Another option is to put a cylindrical viewport > >>> on the K250 tower to bump it up. I haven't done that > >>> myself, but it could be done. > >>> Best, > >>> Alec > >>> On Fri, Jan 30, 2015 at > >>> 11:42 AM, Andr? Eriksen > >>> wrote: > >>> Hi > >>> guys! > >>> Finally I can > >>> start building. Just rented a nice location outside town. > >>> This is the drawing of the sub. I want to have 400meters > >>> (1300ft) of max operating depth. The hull is 10mm > >>> (3/8") S355J2 steel. The ABS hull calculator is giving > >>> me 431,8m (1417ft) of depth, and 638,4m (2094ft) crush > >>> depth. Still have som FEA to do. Have to learn to use a new > >>> software since Autodesk Inventor don`t simulate buckling. > >>> Any thoughts on the design?Do someone want to > >>> confirm my calculations?Very excited to get > >>> started!Sorry for the metric dimensions for you > >>> who are not custom to them. > >>> I had a hard time figuring out the > >>> conning tower. I wanted it to go in one piece, but I want > >>> all the freeboard I can get and not get it too top heavy. > >>> Was thinking about going 20mm thick nozzle all the way up, > >>> but thinking I might get in trouble welding in the hatch > >>> seat ring. With 30mm I could do without welding in a seat > >>> ring, but it would be too top heavy. So decided to go with > >>> the Kittredge design, any thoughts on this? > >>> Domes in top and front and saddle > >>> tanks. > >>> Emile: > >>> If you still want to press domes for me, can you give me the > >>> exact measurements I should have for the bow > >>> ring? > >>> -Andr? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> > >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >>> > >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >>> > >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >>> > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Med Vennlig Hilsen / Regards > >> *Andr? Eriksen* > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >> > >> > > > > > -- > Med Vennlig Hilsen / Regards > *Andr? Eriksen* > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 00:00:11 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 19 Feb 2015 23:00:11 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Models, Posters, and Decorations Message-ID: I have been in my new office for almost a year and a half now and I keep promising myself I am going to decorate it more than just my Mark diving helment desk ortament. Haha.? I am looking for framed posters and models of Alvin, Deep Sea Challenger, Deepworker, Deep Rover, Nautlie, Mir, Perry, Trieste, Shinkai, Atlantis tourist subs, etc.? I am also looking for commerical diving framed posters mostly with Kirby Morgan hat divers. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 10:16:37 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 10:16:37 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Models, Posters, and Decorations In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: A lot of them are out there. Just Google research submersible posters. On Feb 20, 2015 12:01 AM, "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: > I have been in my new office for almost a year and a half now and I keep > promising myself I am going to decorate it more than just my Mark diving > helment desk ortament. Haha. > > I am looking for framed posters and models of Alvin, Deep Sea Challenger, > Deepworker, Deep Rover, Nautlie, Mir, Perry, Trieste, Shinkai, Atlantis > tourist subs, etc. > I am also looking for commerical diving framed posters mostly with Kirby > Morgan hat divers. > > Thanks, > Scott Waters > > > Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 11:50:54 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 08:50:54 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Message-ID: <1424451054.52052.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please. The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 12:27:27 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 09:27:27 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Message-ID: <20150220092727.39E58C02@m0005298.ppops.net> I get 2,333.02 cu in. and the radius of the sphere would be 31.4" Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 08:50:54 -0800 Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please. The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 12:29:53 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 07:29:53 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Models, Posters, and Decorations In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Scott, I have some color pictures I can take out of the frames to scan and email to you if you like but they are not poster size just 8" X 10". Rick On Fri, Feb 20, 2015 at 5:16 AM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > A lot of them are out there. Just Google research submersible posters. > On Feb 20, 2015 12:01 AM, "swaters at waters-ks.com via > Personal_Submersibles" wrote: > >> I have been in my new office for almost a year and a half now and I keep >> promising myself I am going to decorate it more than just my Mark diving >> helment desk ortament. Haha. >> >> I am looking for framed posters and models of Alvin, Deep Sea Challenger, >> Deepworker, Deep Rover, Nautlie, Mir, Perry, Trieste, Shinkai, Atlantis >> tourist subs, etc. >> I am also looking for commerical diving framed posters mostly with Kirby >> Morgan hat divers. >> >> Thanks, >> Scott Waters >> >> >> Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 12:43:17 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 09:43:17 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation In-Reply-To: <20150220092727.39E58C02@m0005298.ppops.net> Message-ID: <1424454197.6900.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Brian, Thank you, what is the formula you use for that. Hank -------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/20/15, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 12:27 PM I get 2,333.02 cu in.? ? and the radius of the sphere would be 31.4" Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 08:50:54 -0800 Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please.? The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 13:05:54 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 10:05:54 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Message-ID: <20150220100554.39E58847@m0005298.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 14:04:11 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 19:04:11 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation In-Reply-To: <1424451054.52052.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1424451054.52052.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1338783931.3031551.1424459051089.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Hank,if you have the dish there, you can pour water in to it& measure how much water, to get the internal volume.But you probably knew that already.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 5:50 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please.? The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 14:46:53 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 11:46:53 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation In-Reply-To: <1338783931.3031551.1424459051089.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1424461613.8641.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Alan, I would have to stand my sub up on the nose to do that :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 2:04 PM Hank,if you have the dish there, you can pour water in to it& measure how much water, to get the internal volume.But you probably knew that already.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 5:50 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please.? The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 21:02:33 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2015 18:02:33 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] compensation issue Message-ID: <1424484153.38199.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Yesterday I dove a ship wreck in the clearest water ever, I could see with lights off at 179 feet, and it was overcast. I changed the compensation bladder from a small inner tube to an old stiff squeeze ball. The sub still had a very small leak, so there is a big improvement. My theory is that the compensation bladder mechanism needs to offer resistance to allow the lip seal to have pressure against it. I noticed at Nuytco that the old DW motors have a very short and small compensation hose. Also the submersible pump motor has a compensation bladder that is spring loaded. My next experiment will be a small stiffer hose that takes more pressure to initially compress allowing the lip seal to press against the rotating shaft. My next dive is to film small White sturgeon that I found a few days ago. Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 20 21:29:46 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 02:29:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation In-Reply-To: <1424461613.8641.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1424461613.8641.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1228680342.3371689.1424485786777.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> That's easy, you shift houses don't you.Interesting about the compensation & the lip seal needing pressure.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:46 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Alan, I would have to stand my sub up on the nose to do that :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 2:04 PM Hank,if you have the dish there, you can pour water in to it& measure how much water, to get the internal volume.But you probably knew that already.Alan ? ? ? ? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org ? Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 5:50 AM ? Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation ? Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please.? The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 21 07:35:57 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 04:35:57 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation In-Reply-To: <1228680342.3371689.1424485786777.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1424522157.33958.YahooMailBasic@web125406.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Alan, Yes I could do it easy but I would have to remove my coffee maker etc. :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 9:29 PM That's easy, you shift houses don't you.Interesting about the compensation & the lip seal needing pressure.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:46 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Alan, I would have to stand my sub up on the nose to do that :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 2:04 PM Hank,if you have the dish there, you can pour water in to it& measure how much water, to get the internal volume.But you probably knew that already.Alan ? ? ? ? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org ? Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 5:50 AM ? Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation ? Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please.? The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 21 10:31:06 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 07:31:06 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lip Seals - Thruster Pressure compensation In-Reply-To: <1228680342.3371689.1424485786777.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1424461613.8641.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <1228680342.3371689.1424485786777.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1424532666.56666.YahooMailNeo@web181204.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Hank, thanks for posting your experience with this oil leak and your steps to mitigate. I am interested in this thread as I am in the process of installing four MK-101 as thrusters for the R300. I have been going back and forth on air vs. oil pressure compensation. My current preference is oil. It seems to me that the pressure compensation method you choose impacts the orientation you should choose for the lip seals. For those of you that have not torn down a MK-101 lower unit, they have a two lip seals on the prop shaft. These seals are oriented such that as the housing is taken deeper, the outboard pressure increases due to ambient water pressure and causes the outer most seal to tighten down on the shaft. These off the shelf seals can be reversed. Factory assembly has both with cups facing outward. These can be reversed and if you want to, you could even mix orientation of the seals. If you choose air compensation, and plan to keep the regulated air pressure 1-2 psi above ambient, then it makes sense to reverse these lip seals as the pressure inside the housing is greater than the pressure outboard. On the other hand, if you use oil for a pressure compensation, then it makes sense to leave the lip seals as originally oriented. To me, if the lip seals have cups facings outboard, then a soft flexible external bladder for the oil makes sense so that as the lower unit heats up and oil wants to escape, it easily pushes into the bladder rather than out past the lip seals. If you had a stiff bladder, then oil would take the path of least resistance and escape past the lip seals as they are not design to see much reverse pressure. Hank, I might have missed it in one of your post but how are the lip seals oriented in your thrusters and are they MK-101's? By the description from your post, it sounds like yours are oriented cups facing inward to benefit from a stiffer bladder. For those of you that have MK lower units, can you comments on lip seal orientation and any issues with seal leaks stiff vs. soft bladders, and small vs large bladders? Did you stay with the factory orientation of the seals (cups facing outward) or did you reverse them? Any experience with oil leaks past theses seals? BTW, I have a machine shop working on an anodized T6-6061 aluminum replacement part for the MK101 part that has the external fin and the shaft seal cavity. The modification I have made is to add material to the inside if this part so that three internal bosses are formed that have female threads. Into these three holes will be threaded 316 SS support rods to hold the Nylon Kort nozzle. Originally I was using a weldment consisting of a strap with the three supports to hold the Kort nozzle but I was having trouble fabricating these accurately enough. I will post a picture of finished thruster with Kort nozzle when I get the parts back. Cliff ________________________________ From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 20, 2015 8:29 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation That's easy, you shift houses don't you. Interesting about the compensation & the lip seal needing pressure. Alan ________________________________ From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:46 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Alan, I would have to stand my sub up on the nose to do that :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 2:04 PM Hank,if you have the dish there, you can pour water in to it& measure how much water, to get the internal volume.But you probably knew that already.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 5:50 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please. The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 21 10:52:41 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 07:52:41 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lip Seals - Thruster Pressure compensation In-Reply-To: <1424532666.56666.YahooMailNeo@web181204.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1424533961.99697.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Cliff, The oil leak issue is on my main drive, not on a thruster. Funny though, my vertical thruster is an old 50 lb Minn Kota and has no compensation system at all. I just filled it with WD and left it alone. The motor is oriented vertical with the prop at the top and gives me no trouble at all. The shaft seal that is leaking a tiny bit is a simple low pressure seal with the lip inside and a small lip outside. The stiffer ball compensator seems to have helped a lot. I think at this point I will change to a higher pressure seal. Gamma also has a second drive shaft that is coupled to the main shaft for jettisoning. The second shaft is in an oil filled housing with the same simple seals and no compensation method at all. I use vegetable oil for environmental reasons so I am not to worried about a drop of oil escaping. Hank -------------------------------------------- On Sat, 2/21/15, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lip Seals - Thruster Pressure compensation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Saturday, February 21, 2015, 10:31 AM Hank, thanks for posting your experience with this oil leak and your steps to mitigate.? I am interested in this thread as I am in the process of installing four MK-101 as thrusters for the R300.? I have been going back and forth on air vs. oil pressure compensation.?? My current preference is oil.???It seems to me that the pressure compensation method you choose impacts the orientation?you should choose for?the lip seals.? For those of you that have not torn down a MK-101 lower unit, they have a two lip seals on the prop shaft.?These seals are oriented such that as the housing is taken deeper, the outboard?pressure increases due to ambient water pressure and causes the outer most seal to tighten down on the shaft.? These off the shelf seals can be reversed.??Factory assembly has both with cups facing outward.? These can be reversed and if you want to, you could even mix orientation of the seals.? If you choose air compensation, and plan to keep the regulated air pressure 1-2 psi above ambient, then it makes sense to reverse these lip seals as the pressure inside the housing is greater than the pressure outboard.? On the other hand, if you use oil for a pressure compensation, then it makes sense to leave the lip seals as originally oriented.? To me, if the lip seals have cups facings outboard, then a soft flexible external bladder for the oil makes sense so that as the lower unit heats up and oil wants to escape, it easily pushes into the bladder rather than out past the lip seals.? If you had a stiff bladder, then oil would?take the path of least resistance and escape past?the lip seals as they are not design to see much reverse pressure.? Hank, I might have missed it in one of your post but how are the lip seals oriented in your thrusters and are they MK-101's?? By the description from your post, it sounds like yours are oriented cups facing inward to benefit from a stiffer bladder. For those of you that have MK lower units, can you comments on lip seal orientation and any issues with seal leaks stiff vs. soft bladders, and small vs large bladders?? Did you?stay with?the factory orientation of the seals (cups facing outward) or did you reverse them?? Any experience with oil leaks past theses seals? BTW,? I? have a machine shop working on an anodized T6-6061 aluminum replacement part for the MK101 part that has the external fin and the shaft ?seal cavity.?The modification I have made is to add material to the inside if this part so that?three internal bosses are formed that?have female threads.? Into these three holes will be threaded 316 SS support rods to hold the Nylon Kort nozzle.? Originally I was using a weldment consisting of a strap with the three supports to hold the Kort nozzle?but? I was having trouble fabricating these accurately enough.?I will post a picture of finished thruster with Kort nozzle when I get the parts back. Cliff From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 20, 2015 8:29 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation That's easy, you shift houses don't you.Interesting about the compensation & the lip seal needing pressure.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:46 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Alan, I would have to stand my sub up on the nose to do that :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 2:04 PM Hank,if you have the dish there, you can pour water in to it& measure how much water, to get the internal volume.But you probably knew that already.Alan ? ? ? ? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org ? Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 5:50 AM ? Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation ? Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please.? The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 21 11:35:54 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (swaters@waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 10:35:54 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Models, Posters, and Decorations Message-ID: <54my7vwkhx1vfjfntad1jstr.1424536554320@email.android.com> Rick, That would be awesome. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles Date:02/20/2015 11:29 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Cc: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Models, Posters, and Decorations Scott, I have some color pictures I can take out of the frames to scan and email to you if you like but they are not poster size just 8" X 10". Rick On Fri, Feb 20, 2015 at 5:16 AM, Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles wrote: A lot of them are out there. Just Google research submersible posters. On Feb 20, 2015 12:01 AM, "swaters at waters-ks.com via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: I have been in my new office for almost a year and a half now and I keep promising myself I am going to decorate it more than just my Mark diving helment desk ortament. Haha. I am looking for framed posters and models of Alvin, Deep Sea Challenger, Deepworker, Deep Rover, Nautlie, Mir, Perry, Trieste, Shinkai, Atlantis tourist subs, etc. I am also looking for commerical diving framed posters mostly with Kirby Morgan hat divers. Thanks, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 21 13:39:00 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 13:39:00 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lip Seals - Thruster Pressure compensation In-Reply-To: <1424532666.56666.YahooMailNeo@web181204.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1424461613.8641.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <1228680342.3371689.1424485786777.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <1424532666.56666.YahooMailNeo@web181204.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Cliff, I agree 100% on all you just said. Snoopy uses oil compensation and the seals are in the standard orientation. No leaks until they eventually just wore out after years of use (and were easily replaced). I like your new aluminum piece, that should be good! Where was it you got the kort nozzles again? I have tried three times to contact the guy (George) who makes the Gavin scooter, to buy his nozzles, but have never managed to get hold of him or a response from him. Thanks, Alec On Sat, Feb 21, 2015 at 10:31 AM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hank, thanks for posting your experience with this oil leak and your steps > to mitigate. I am interested in this thread as I am in the process of > installing four MK-101 as thrusters for the R300. I have been going back > and forth on air vs. oil pressure compensation. My current preference is > oil. It seems to me that the pressure compensation method you choose > impacts the orientation you should choose for the lip seals. For those of > you that have not torn down a MK-101 lower unit, they have a two lip seals > on the prop shaft. These seals are oriented such that as the housing is > taken deeper, the outboard pressure increases due to ambient water pressure > and causes the outer most seal to tighten down on the shaft. These off the > shelf seals can be reversed. Factory assembly has both with cups facing > outward. These can be reversed and if you want to, you could even mix > orientation of the seals. If you choose air compensation, and plan to keep > the regulated air pressure 1-2 psi above ambient, then it makes sense to > reverse these lip seals as the pressure inside the housing is greater than > the pressure outboard. On the other hand, if you use oil for a pressure > compensation, then it makes sense to leave the lip seals as originally > oriented. To me, if the lip seals have cups facings outboard, then a soft > flexible external bladder for the oil makes sense so that as the lower unit > heats up and oil wants to escape, it easily pushes into the bladder rather > than out past the lip seals. If you had a stiff bladder, then oil > would take the path of least resistance and escape past the lip seals as > they are not design to see much reverse pressure. > > Hank, I might have missed it in one of your post but how are the lip seals > oriented in your thrusters and are they MK-101's? By the description from > your post, it sounds like yours are oriented cups facing inward to benefit > from a stiffer bladder. > > For those of you that have MK lower units, can you comments on lip seal > orientation and any issues with seal leaks stiff vs. soft bladders, and > small vs large bladders? Did you stay with the factory orientation of the > seals (cups facing outward) or did you reverse them? Any experience with > oil leaks past theses seals? > > BTW, I have a machine shop working on an anodized T6-6061 aluminum > replacement part for the MK101 part that has the external fin and the shaft > seal cavity. The modification I have made is to add material to the inside > if this part so that three internal bosses are formed that have female > threads. Into these three holes will be threaded 316 SS support rods to > hold the Nylon Kort nozzle. Originally I was using a weldment consisting > of a strap with the three supports to hold the Kort nozzle but I was > having trouble fabricating these accurately enough. I will post a picture > of finished thruster with Kort nozzle when I get the parts back. > > Cliff > > *From:* Alan James via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *Sent:* Friday, February 20, 2015 8:29 PM > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation > > That's easy, you shift houses don't you. > Interesting about the compensation & the lip seal needing pressure. > Alan > > > > *From:* hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *Sent:* Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:46 AM > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation > > > Alan, > I would have to stand my sub up on the nose to do that :-) > Hank-------------------------------------------- > On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 2:04 PM > > Hank,if you > have the dish there, you can pour water in to > it& > measure how much water, to get the internal > volume.But > you probably knew that already.Alan > > From: hank pronk via > Personal_Submersibles > > > To: > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Sent: Saturday, > February 21, 2015 5:50 AM > Subject: > [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation > > > Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for > me please. The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. > Thank you > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 21 15:26:58 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2015 12:26:58 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lip Seals - Thruster Pressure compensation In-Reply-To: References: <1424461613.8641.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <1228680342.3371689.1424485786777.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> <1424532666.56666.YahooMailNeo@web181204.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1424550418.35274.YahooMailNeo@web181205.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Thanks for the post Alec, with the hours you have had Snoopy in the water, this feedback is important. As to Kort nozzle, I designed the part to be machined out of Nylon from my local machine shop. The shop has finished these parts and I am waiting on him to finish the support hubs as well as a support that screw into the exiting support boss on the MK-101s. I used a Wageningen ducted propeller series 37 profile as a basis for the design. I am anxious to get one of these into the water to an do some bollard thrust measurements. I have rewired all the ship systems to accommodate a 36V battery bank and the new MD motor controllers. Works really nice on the bench. ________________________________ From: Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 12:39 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lip Seals - Thruster Pressure compensation Hi Cliff, I agree 100% on all you just said. Snoopy uses oil compensation and the seals are in the standard orientation. No leaks until they eventually just wore out after years of use (and were easily replaced). I like your new aluminum piece, that should be good! Where was it you got the kort nozzles again? I have tried three times to contact the guy (George) who makes the Gavin scooter, to buy his nozzles, but have never managed to get hold of him or a response from him. Thanks, Alec On Sat, Feb 21, 2015 at 10:31 AM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > >Hank, thanks for posting your experience with this oil leak and your steps to mitigate. I am interested in this thread as I am in the process of installing four MK-101 as thrusters for the R300. I have been going back and forth on air vs. oil pressure compensation. My current preference is oil. It seems to me that the pressure compensation method you choose impacts the orientation you should choose for the lip seals. For those of you that have not torn down a MK-101 lower unit, they have a two lip seals on the prop shaft. These seals are oriented such that as the housing is taken deeper, the outboard pressure increases due to ambient water pressure and causes the outer most seal to tighten down on the shaft. These off the shelf seals can be reversed. Factory assembly has both with cups facing outward. These can be reversed and if you want to, you could even mix orientation of the seals. If you choose air compensation, and plan to keep the regulated air pressure 1-2 psi above ambient, then it makes sense to reverse these lip seals as the pressure inside the housing is greater than the pressure outboard. On the other hand, if you use oil for a pressure compensation, then it makes sense to leave the lip seals as originally oriented. To me, if the lip seals have cups facings outboard, then a soft flexible external bladder for the oil makes sense so that as the lower unit heats up and oil wants to escape, it easily pushes into the bladder rather than out past the lip seals. If you had a stiff bladder, then oil would take the path of least resistance and escape past the lip seals as they are not design to see much reverse pressure. > > >Hank, I might have missed it in one of your post but how are the lip seals oriented in your thrusters and are they MK-101's? By the description from your post, it sounds like yours are oriented cups facing inward to benefit from a stiffer bladder. > >For those of you that have MK lower units, can you comments on lip seal orientation and any issues with seal leaks stiff vs. soft bladders, and small vs large bladders? Did you stay with the factory orientation of the seals (cups facing outward) or did you reverse them? Any experience with oil leaks past theses seals? > > >BTW, I have a machine shop working on an anodized T6-6061 aluminum replacement part for the MK101 part that has the external fin and the shaft seal cavity. The modification I have made is to add material to the inside if this part so that three internal bosses are formed that have female threads. Into these three holes will be threaded 316 SS support rods to hold the Nylon Kort nozzle. Originally I was using a weldment consisting of a strap with the three supports to hold the Kort nozzle but I was having trouble fabricating these accurately enough. I will post a picture of finished thruster with Kort nozzle when I get the parts back. > >Cliff > > > From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles >To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >Sent: Friday, February 20, 2015 8:29 PM >Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation > > > >That's easy, you shift houses don't you. >Interesting about the compensation & the lip seal needing pressure. >Alan > > > > > From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles >To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:46 AM >Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation > > > >Alan, >I would have to stand my sub up on the nose to do that :-) >Hank-------------------------------------------- >On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > >Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation >To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" >Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 2:04 PM > >Hank,if you >have the dish there, you can pour water in to >it& >measure how much water, to get the internal >volume.But >you probably knew that already.Alan > > From: hank pronk via >Personal_Submersibles > > >To: >personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Sent: Saturday, >February 21, 2015 5:50 AM > Subject: >[PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation > > >Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for >me please. The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. >Thank you >Hank >_______________________________________________ >Personal_Submersibles mailing list >Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > >-----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > > > > >_______________________________________________ >Personal_Submersibles mailing list >Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > >_______________________________________________ >Personal_Submersibles mailing list >Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > >_______________________________________________ >Personal_Submersibles mailing list >Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > >_______________________________________________ >Personal_Submersibles mailing list >Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 21 19:27:41 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2015 00:27:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lip Seals - Thruster Pressure compensation In-Reply-To: <1424532666.56666.YahooMailNeo@web181204.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1424532666.56666.YahooMailNeo@web181204.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1279935682.3706160.1424564861418.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Cliff,using the regulator for pressurizing your thrusters, you will be able to haveboth air & oil systems by just adding or draining the oil.?It will be easy for you?to have both operating concurrently for a comparison.I would be interested in heating comparisons between oil & air if youhappen to do them.Alan From: Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2015 4:31 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lip Seals - Thruster Pressure compensation Hank, thanks for posting your experience with this oil leak and your steps to mitigate.? I am interested in this thread as I am in the process of installing four MK-101 as thrusters for the R300.? I have been going back and forth on air vs. oil pressure compensation.?? My current preference is oil.???It seems to me that the pressure compensation method you choose impacts the orientation?you should choose for?the lip seals.? For those of you that have not torn down a MK-101 lower unit, they have a two lip seals on the prop shaft.?These seals are oriented such that as the housing is taken deeper, the outboard?pressure increases due to ambient water pressure and causes the outer most seal to tighten down on the shaft.? These off the shelf seals can be reversed.??Factory assembly has both with cups facing outward.? These can be reversed and if you want to, you could even mix orientation of the seals.? If you choose air compensation, and plan to keep the regulated air pressure 1-2 psi above ambient, then it makes sense to reverse these lip seals as the pressure inside the housing is greater than the pressure outboard.? On the other hand, if you use oil for a pressure compensation, then it makes sense to leave the lip seals as originally oriented.? To me, if the lip seals have cups facings outboard, then a soft flexible external bladder for the oil makes sense so that as the lower unit heats up and oil wants to escape, it easily pushes into the bladder rather than out past the lip seals.? If you had a stiff bladder, then oil would?take the path of least resistance and escape past?the lip seals as they are not design to see much reverse pressure.? Hank, I might have missed it in one of your post but how are the lip seals oriented in your thrusters and are they MK-101's?? By the description from your post, it sounds like yours are oriented cups facing inward to benefit from a stiffer bladder. For those of you that have MK lower units, can you comments on lip seal orientation and any issues with seal leaks stiff vs. soft bladders, and small vs large bladders?? Did you?stay with?the factory orientation of the seals (cups facing outward) or did you reverse them?? Any experience with oil leaks past theses seals? BTW,? I? have a machine shop working on an anodized T6-6061 aluminum replacement part for the MK101 part that has the external fin and the shaft ?seal cavity.?The modification I have made is to add material to the inside if this part so that?three internal bosses are formed that?have female threads.? Into these three holes will be threaded 316 SS support rods to hold the Nylon Kort nozzle.? Originally I was using a weldment consisting of a strap with the three supports to hold the Kort nozzle?but? I was having trouble fabricating these accurately enough.?I will post a picture of finished thruster with Kort nozzle when I get the parts back. Cliff From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Friday, February 20, 2015 8:29 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation That's easy, you shift houses don't you.Interesting about the compensation & the lip seal needing pressure.Alan From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 8:46 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation Alan, I would have to stand my sub up on the nose to do that :-) Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/20/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 20, 2015, 2:04 PM Hank,if you have the dish there, you can pour water in to it& measure how much water, to get the internal volume.But you probably knew that already.Alan ? ? ? ? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org ? Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2015 5:50 AM ? Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] calculation ? Can someone calculate the volume of a dish for me please.? The dish is 34in dia and 5 in deep. Thank you Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 23 15:18:34 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (=?UTF-8?Q?H=C3=A5vard_Hardy?= via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 21:18:34 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie Message-ID: i allways wantet to build a sub, but still got allot of research to do.. there is a few things i could not find the answer in the internet, so have to ask here. i was thinking of building a small 1 man sub. i used the psub Unstiffened Cylinder Calculator to check how thick the hull hadd to be, to get to 200 meters, the hull have to be over 15mm thick.. so thought maybe i should use ribbs to get it thinner, but dont know how to calculate whit ribs, and how to find out how many ribs i need, and spacing betwen them. a few other tecnical things i dont know. How to you keep the pressure not to rise in the pressure hull? you need oxygen, so the pressure will rise?.. and how do you get the propeler shaft thru the hull, and not get water in the sub. easy on a boat where the pressure is not so big, but att 500 feet? does somone sell the through hulls to get wires thru the pressure hull? or do i have to make on my own? if the pressure hull have a operation deapth off 500 feet, how do i find out how thick the Viewports have to be.. and does anyone no of a good drawing program to draw the sub? have only made it on paper.. need to make on the computer and get a FEA. probably have many other things coming :) H?vard. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 23 15:57:35 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Emile van Essen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 21:57:35 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie In-Reply-To: Message-ID: H?vard, Some quick awnsers.. i was thinking of building a small 1 man sub. i used the psub Unstiffened Cylinder Calculator to check how thick the hull hadd to be, to get to 200 meters, the hull have to be over 15mm thick.. so thought maybe i should use ribbs to get it thinner, but dont know how to calculate whit ribs, and how to find out how many ribs i need, and spacing betwen them. > Hull dia?? a few other tecnical things i dont know. How to you keep the pressure not to rise in the pressure hull? you need oxygen, so the pressure will rise?.. >>You consume / burn the oxygen. No pressure rise and how do you get the propeler shaft thru the hull, and not get water in the sub. easy on a boat where the pressure is not so big, but att 500 feet? >> ceramic / mechanical seal like in pumps does somone sell the through hulls to get wires thru the pressure hull? or do i have to make on my own? >> Subconn and similar company?s sell them. You can also use high pressure cable glands (up to 400 M) Or make your own with brass and Epoxy. if the pressure hull have a operation deapth off 500 feet, how do i find out how thick the Viewports have to be.. See table: You only have to translate a few German words. and does anyone no of a good drawing program to draw the sub? have only made it on paper.. need to make on the computer and get a FEA. If you want it legal: ZWcad is a cheap but good Autocad clone Regards, Emile -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: AcrylicportholesGermanischerLloyd01.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 233949 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 23 17:43:32 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Petar Topljak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 23:43:32 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, To calculate viewports and pressure vessel (hull) you can download for free ASME PVHO standard which is very simple and guides you trough the process. Standard provides stiffener geometry, window geometry etc. Regards, H?vard, Some quick awnsers.. i was thinking of building a small 1 man sub. i used the psub Unstiffened Cylinder Calculator to check how thick the hull hadd to be, to get to 200 meters, the hull have to be over 15mm thick.. so thought maybe i should use ribbs to get it thinner, but dont know how to calculate whit ribs, and how to find out how many ribs i need, and spacing betwen them. > Hull dia?? a few other tecnical things i dont know. How to you keep the pressure not to rise in the pressure hull? you need oxygen, so the pressure will rise?.. >>You consume / burn the oxygen. No pressure rise and how do you get the propeler shaft thru the hull, and not get water in the sub. easy on a boat where the pressure is not so big, but att 500 feet? >> ceramic / mechanical seal like in pumps does somone sell the through hulls to get wires thru the pressure hull? or do i have to make on my own? >> Subconn and similar company?s sell them. You can also use high pressure cable glands (up to 400 M) Or make your own with brass and Epoxy. if the pressure hull have a operation deapth off 500 feet, how do i find out how thick the *Viewports have to be..* See table: You only have to translate a few German words. *and does anyone no of a good drawing program to draw the sub? have only made it on paper.. need to make on the computer and get a FEA.* If you want it legal: ZWcad is a cheap but good Autocad clone *Regards, Emile* _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 23 18:20:28 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 15:20:28 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Here is a link to a presentation in 2004 by Dr. Jerry D. Stachiw on acrylic viewports. Worth a read as well. http://www.hydroports.com/documents/New_Orleans_Meeting-Feb_2004.pdf Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Mon, Feb 23, 2015 at 2:43 PM, Petar Topljak via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi, > > To calculate viewports and pressure vessel (hull) you can download for > free ASME PVHO standard which is very simple and guides you trough the > process. Standard provides stiffener geometry, window geometry etc. > > Regards, > > H?vard, > > > > Some quick awnsers.. > > > > i was thinking of building a small 1 man sub. i used the psub Unstiffened > Cylinder Calculator to check how > thick the hull hadd to be, to get to 200 meters, the hull have to be over > 15mm thick.. so thought maybe i should use ribbs to get it thinner, but > dont know how to calculate whit ribs, and how to find out how many ribs i > need, and spacing betwen them. > > > Hull dia?? > > > > a few other tecnical things i dont know. > > > > How to you keep the pressure not to rise in the pressure hull? you need > oxygen, so the pressure will rise?.. > > >>You consume / burn the oxygen. No pressure rise > > > > and how do you get the propeler shaft thru the hull, and not get water in > the sub. easy on a boat where the pressure is not so big, but att 500 feet > ? > > >> ceramic / mechanical seal like in pumps > > > > does somone sell the through hulls to get wires thru the pressure hull? > or do i have to make on my own? > > >> Subconn and similar company?s sell them. You can also use high pressure > cable glands (up to 400 M) Or make your own with brass and Epoxy. > > > > if the pressure hull have a operation deapth off 500 feet, how do i find > out how thick the *Viewports have to be..* > > See table: You only have to translate a few German words. > > > > *and does anyone no of a good drawing program to draw the sub? have only > made it on paper.. need to make on the computer and get a FEA.* > > If you want it legal: ZWcad is a cheap but good Autocad clone > > > > *Regards, Emile* > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Feb 23 18:49:22 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 23:49:22 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1788882003.3512915.1424735362823.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Hi Havard,a couple of years ago I looked at ZW cad & it was economical but didn't have an FEA option.It might have changed since.You could export the file to another program (can't remember it's name) but this program wasvery expensive.I bought Rhino 5 & two plug ins, "Orca" (marine design) & scan & solve, which is a basic FEAprogram. I am doubtful of the accuracy of scan & solve as I questioned one of their experts& he was very evasive on how accurate the program was. It is generally thought best to leave?FEA up to the experts.Emile touched on your question about pressure build up. Oxygen is fed in at the same rate asyou consume it & is breathed out in identical volume as CO2. The CO2 is removed in the CO2scrubber.Alan From: H?vard Hardy via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2015 9:18 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie i allways wantet to build a sub, but still got allot of?research to do.. there is a few things i could not find the?answer in the internet, so have to ask here. i was thinking of?building?a small 1 man sub. i used the psub?Unstiffened Cylinder Calculator?to check how thick the hull hadd to be, to get to 200 meters, the hull have to be over 15mm thick.. so thought maybe i should use ribbs to get it thinner, but dont know how to calculate whit ribs, and how to find out how many ribs i need, and spacing betwen them. a few other tecnical things i dont know. How to you keep the pressure not to rise in the pressure hull? you need oxygen, so the pressure will rise?.. and how do you get the propeler shaft thru the hull, and not get water in the sub. easy on a boat where the pressure is not so big, but att 500 feet? does somone sell the?through hulls to get wires thru the pressure hull? or do i have to make on my own? if the pressure hull have a operation deapth off 500 feet, how do i find out how thick the?Viewports have to be.. and does anyone no of a good drawing program to draw the sub? have only made it on paper.. need to make on the computer and get a FEA. probably have many other things coming :) H?vard. _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 24 08:40:34 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Emile van Essen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2015 14:40:34 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie In-Reply-To: <1788882003.3512915.1424735362823.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: FEA is one of the few things I leave to sombody else. The accurate programs are expensive and need a supercomputer.. Emile _____ Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: dinsdag 24 februari 2015 0:49 Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Onderwerp: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie Hi Havard, a couple of years ago I looked at ZW cad & it was economical but didn't have an FEA option. It might have changed since. You could export the file to another program (can't remember it's name) but this program was very expensive. I bought Rhino 5 & two plug ins, "Orca" (marine design) & scan & solve, which is a basic FEA program. I am doubtful of the accuracy of scan & solve as I questioned one of their experts & he was very evasive on how accurate the program was. It is generally thought best to leave FEA up to the experts. Emile touched on your question about pressure build up. Oxygen is fed in at the same rate as you consume it & is breathed out in identical volume as CO2. The CO2 is removed in the CO2 scrubber. Alan _____ From: H?vard Hardy via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2015 9:18 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie i allways wantet to build a sub, but still got allot of research to do.. there is a few things i could not find the answer in the internet, so have to ask here. i was thinking of building a small 1 man sub. i used the psub Unstiffened Cylinder Calculator to check how thick the hull hadd to be, to get to 200 meters, the hull have to be over 15mm thick.. so thought maybe i should use ribbs to get it thinner, but dont know how to calculate whit ribs, and how to find out how many ribs i need, and spacing betwen them. a few other tecnical things i dont know. How to you keep the pressure not to rise in the pressure hull? you need oxygen, so the pressure will rise?.. and how do you get the propeler shaft thru the hull, and not get water in the sub. easy on a boat where the pressure is not so big, but att 500 feet? does somone sell the through hulls to get wires thru the pressure hull? or do i have to make on my own? if the pressure hull have a operation deapth off 500 feet, how do i find out how thick the Viewports have to be.. and does anyone no of a good drawing program to draw the sub? have only made it on paper.. need to make on the computer and get a FEA. probably have many other things coming :) H?vard. _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Feb 24 17:10:34 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2015 22:10:34 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie In-Reply-To: <1788882003.3512915.1424735362823.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1788882003.3512915.1424735362823.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <866191812.10060408.1424815835013.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Havard,should have mentioned the book "Manned Submersibles". There is a?link to an e version on the Psub site.Old but relevant & I know a lot of the members have read it or have copies,& would endorse it as a good start to a sub building project.Alan From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2015 12:49 PM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie Hi Havard,a couple of years ago I looked at ZW cad & it was economical but didn't have an FEA option.It might have changed since.You could export the file to another program (can't remember it's name) but this program wasvery expensive.I bought Rhino 5 & two plug ins, "Orca" (marine design) & scan & solve, which is a basic FEAprogram. I am doubtful of the accuracy of scan & solve as I questioned one of their experts& he was very evasive on how accurate the program was. It is generally thought best to leave?FEA up to the experts.Emile touched on your question about pressure build up. Oxygen is fed in at the same rate asyou consume it & is breathed out in identical volume as CO2. The CO2 is removed in the CO2scrubber.Alan From: H?vard Hardy via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2015 9:18 AM Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] many questions from a rookie i allways wantet to build a sub, but still got allot of?research to do.. there is a few things i could not find the?answer in the internet, so have to ask here. i was thinking of?building?a small 1 man sub. i used the psub?Unstiffened Cylinder Calculator?to check how thick the hull hadd to be, to get to 200 meters, the hull have to be over 15mm thick.. so thought maybe i should use ribbs to get it thinner, but dont know how to calculate whit ribs, and how to find out how many ribs i need, and spacing betwen them. a few other tecnical things i dont know. How to you keep the pressure not to rise in the pressure hull? you need oxygen, so the pressure will rise?.. and how do you get the propeler shaft thru the hull, and not get water in the sub. easy on a boat where the pressure is not so big, but att 500 feet? does somone sell the?through hulls to get wires thru the pressure hull? or do i have to make on my own? if the pressure hull have a operation deapth off 500 feet, how do i find out how thick the?Viewports have to be.. and does anyone no of a good drawing program to draw the sub? have only made it on paper.. need to make on the computer and get a FEA. probably have many other things coming :) H?vard. _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 26 20:42:31 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 17:42:31 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome Message-ID: <1425001351.9633.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Today I officially took the plunge and removed the forward ballast tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big city yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should have it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a pressure welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the big city to machine the ring. Hank From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Feb 26 23:41:34 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 20:41:34 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: <1425001351.9633.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1425001351.9633.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002c01d05247$aa7bf370$ff73da50$@telus.net> That must have been a tough decision, Hank. Gamma is now no longer an authentic Nekton, but who cares? You should have the boat that you want, rather than some not so useful collector's item. Let me know when you will be next in town, it would be great to get together if it times out. Tim -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-26-15 5:43 PM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome Today I officially took the plunge and removed the forward ballast tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big city yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should have it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a pressure welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the big city to machine the ring. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 04:08:26 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 09:08:26 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: <1425001351.9633.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1425001351.9633.YahooMailBasic@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi hank, Sounds like it will be a good modification. How are they going to machine the ring? Some sort of vertical mill? Regards James On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Today I officially took the plunge and removed the forward ballast tank to > install my new bow dome. After much agony I decided to make the change. I > am not enjoying the sub because the forward window arrangement is not ideal > for lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big city yesterday and > picked up the reinforcing ring and should have it fitted in a couple of > days. I am bringing in a pressure welder to weld the ring and then the sub > is off to the big city to machine the ring. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 06:45:57 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 03:45:57 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1425037557.92775.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> James, I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A vertical mill is probably the way to go. I am checking out another option also. There are machines made to machine pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. There is a company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not sure yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil industry. You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready Monday. Hank -------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM Hi hank,Sounds like it will be a good modification.? How are they going to machine the ring?? Some sort of vertical mill?RegardsJames On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Today I officially took the plunge and removed the forward ballast tank to install my new bow dome.? After much agony I decided to make the change.? I am not enjoying the sub because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for lakes with marginal visibility.? I went to the big city yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should have it fitted in a couple of days.? I am bringing in a pressure welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the big city to machine the ring. Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 06:50:47 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 03:50:47 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: <002c01d05247$aa7bf370$ff73da50$@telus.net> Message-ID: <1425037847.88604.YahooMailBasic@web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Tim, Your right, better to enjoy the full potential. I will let you know when I am in Vancouver for sure. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Thu, 2/26/15, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" Received: Thursday, February 26, 2015, 11:41 PM That must have been a tough decision, Hank. Gamma is now no longer an authentic Nekton, but who cares?? You should have the boat that you want, rather than some not so useful collector's item. Let me know when you will be next in town, it would be great to get together if it times out. Tim -----Original Message----- From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: February-26-15 5:43 PM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome Today I officially took the plunge and removed the forward ballast tank to install my new bow dome.? After much agony I decided to make the change.? I am not enjoying the sub because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for lakes with marginal visibility.? I went to the big city yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should have it fitted in a couple of days.? I am bringing in a pressure welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the big city to machine the ring. Hank? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 07:28:07 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 12:28:07 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: <1425037557.92775.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1425037557.92775.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Do you need to go to all that trouble? When I did mine, the reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and I just pre-heated it and welded it in. It was so big I don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't leak. Just thinking of saving you what sounds like an expensive job. On 27 February 2015 at 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > James, > I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A vertical mill > is probably the way to go. I am checking out another option also. There > are machines made to machine pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. > There is a company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not sure > yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live only 3 hr from a big > oil town that caters to the oil industry. You can tell that oil is low, > and the shops are slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready > Monday. > Hank -------------------------------------------- > On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM > > Hi hank,Sounds like > it will be a good modification. How are they going to > machine the ring? Some sort of vertical > mill?RegardsJames > > On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via > Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > Today I > officially took the plunge and removed the forward ballast > tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I > decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub > because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for > lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big city > yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should have > it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a pressure > welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the big > city to machine the ring. > > Hank > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 08:23:51 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 05:23:51 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1425043431.37647.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> James, I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that it will not warp at least a small amount. I am not experienced with how such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM Do you need to go to all that trouble?? When I did mine, the reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and I just pre-heated it and welded it in.??It was so big I don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't leak.?Just thinking of saving you what sounds like an expensive job. On 27 February 2015 at 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James, I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A vertical mill is probably the way to go.? I am checking out another option also.? There are machines made to machine pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable.? There is a company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not sure yet what the accuracy is yet.? It is nice that I live only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil industry.? You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are slower.? I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready Monday. Hank? ? -------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ?To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ?Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM ?Hi hank,Sounds like ?it will be a good modification.? How are they going to ?machine the ring?? Some sort of vertical ?mill?RegardsJames ?On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via ?Personal_Submersibles ?wrote: ?Today I ?officially took the plunge and removed the forward ballast ?tank to install my new bow dome.? After much agony I ?decided to make the change.? I am not enjoying the sub ?because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for ?lakes with marginal visibility.? I went to the big city ?yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should have ?it fitted in a couple of days.? I am bringing in a pressure ?welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the big ?city to machine the ring. ?Hank ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 08:40:53 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 13:40:53 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: <1425043431.37647.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <1425043431.37647.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: ?Hi Hank. Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket. The actual edge of the acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium ring. That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like you say. Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway. My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring. Im pretty sure there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler. The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly. I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after welding. You wont have to worry at all then. ? On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > James, > I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that it > will not warp at least a small amount. I am not experienced with how such > heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give you > some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. > Hank-------------------------------------------- > On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM > > Do > you need to go to all that trouble? When I did mine, the > reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and > I just pre-heated it and welded it in. It was so big I > don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't > leak. Just thinking of saving you > what sounds like an expensive job. > On 27 February 2015 at > 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote: > James, > > I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A > vertical mill is probably the way to go. I am checking out > another option also. There are machines made to machine > pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. There is a > company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not > sure yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live > only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil > industry. You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are > slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready > Monday. > > Hank -------------------------------------------- > > On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles > > wrote: > > > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome > > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" > > > Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM > > > > Hi hank,Sounds like > > it will be a good > modification. How are they going to > > machine the ring? Some sort of vertical > > mill?RegardsJames > > > > On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via > > Personal_Submersibles > > wrote: > > Today I > > officially took the plunge and removed the forward > ballast > > tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I > > decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub > > because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for > > lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big > city > > yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should > have > > it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a > pressure > > welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the > big > > city to machine the ring. > > > > Hank > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76376 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 09:05:11 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 09:05:11 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: References: <1425043431.37647.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi James, That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well? My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. Thanks, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > ?Hi Hank. > > Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket. The actual edge of the acrylic > itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium ring. That > ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like you say. > Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway. > > My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and see > if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring. Im pretty sure there > is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler. The > alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly. > > I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after welding. > You wont have to worry at all then. > > > ? > > > > > On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> >> James, >> I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that it >> will not warp at least a small amount. I am not experienced with how such >> heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give you >> some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. >> Hank-------------------------------------------- >> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM >> >> Do >> you need to go to all that trouble? When I did mine, the >> reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and >> I just pre-heated it and welded it in. It was so big I >> don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't >> leak. Just thinking of saving you >> what sounds like an expensive job. >> On 27 February 2015 at >> 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >> wrote: >> James, >> >> I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A >> vertical mill is probably the way to go. I am checking out >> another option also. There are machines made to machine >> pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. There is a >> company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not >> sure yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live >> only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil >> industry. You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are >> slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready >> Monday. >> >> Hank -------------------------------------------- >> >> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >> >> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" >> >> >> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM >> >> >> >> Hi hank,Sounds like >> >> it will be a good >> modification. How are they going to >> >> machine the ring? Some sort of vertical >> >> mill?RegardsJames >> >> >> >> On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via >> >> Personal_Submersibles >> >> wrote: >> >> Today I >> >> officially took the plunge and removed the forward >> ballast >> >> tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I >> >> decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub >> >> because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for >> >> lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big >> city >> >> yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should >> have >> >> it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a >> pressure >> >> welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the >> big >> >> city to machine the ring. >> >> >> >> Hank >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> >> >> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> >> >> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> >> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76376 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 09:56:36 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 14:56:36 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: References: <1425043431.37647.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Alec, The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the dome. This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs who came to visit me. Although of course it should provide sealing at higher pressure. Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested I would need another seal for low pressure. So, I made the low pressure seal an O ring sitting in a machined groove in the retaining ring. See hastily drawn picture. The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in the picture, which is of course not to scale or anything. I would love to say it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit. To start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer. This didn't work as I couldn't get the O ring to stay in. Then I machined it for a very small O ring. Couldn't get it in. Eventually, I got a groove and O ring combination that seemed to work. There is lots of silicone grease on all surfaces as well. It doesn't leak. Regards James ? ? On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi James, > > That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have > just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well? > > My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the > window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering > whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so > one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O > ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked > well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The > other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it > with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the > seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of > course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. > > > Thanks, > > Alec > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > >> ?Hi Hank. >> >> Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket. The actual edge of the >> acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium >> ring. That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like >> you say. Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway. >> >> My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and >> see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring. Im pretty sure >> there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler. >> The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly. >> >> I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after >> welding. You wont have to worry at all then. >> >> >> ? >> >> >> >> >> On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >>> >>> James, >>> I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that >>> it will not warp at least a small amount. I am not experienced with how >>> such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give >>> you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. >>> Hank-------------------------------------------- >>> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM >>> >>> Do >>> you need to go to all that trouble? When I did mine, the >>> reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and >>> I just pre-heated it and welded it in. It was so big I >>> don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't >>> leak. Just thinking of saving you >>> what sounds like an expensive job. >>> On 27 February 2015 at >>> 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>> wrote: >>> James, >>> >>> I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A >>> vertical mill is probably the way to go. I am checking out >>> another option also. There are machines made to machine >>> pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. There is a >>> company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not >>> sure yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live >>> only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil >>> industry. You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are >>> slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready >>> Monday. >>> >>> Hank -------------------------------------------- >>> >>> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >>> >>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" >>> >>> >>> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM >>> >>> >>> >>> Hi hank,Sounds like >>> >>> it will be a good >>> modification. How are they going to >>> >>> machine the ring? Some sort of vertical >>> >>> mill?RegardsJames >>> >>> >>> >>> On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Today I >>> >>> officially took the plunge and removed the forward >>> ballast >>> >>> tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I >>> >>> decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub >>> >>> because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for >>> >>> lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big >>> city >>> >>> yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should >>> have >>> >>> it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a >>> pressure >>> >>> welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the >>> big >>> >>> city to machine the ring. >>> >>> >>> >>> Hank >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> >>> >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> >>> >>> >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76376 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Dome222.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 53468 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 10:35:33 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 10:35:33 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: References: <1425043431.37647.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks, you went to some trouble making that drawing, but it certainly added clarity. In my case the outside wall of the acrylic is completely square and there's virtually no gap at all between seat and window, its literally a few thousandths. I could machine the seat to take an O-ring groove, as you did with the retaining ring. However, PVHO 2-2.11.1 says "As primary seals for standard window geometries shown in Figs. 2-2.1 through 2-2.4, a soft elastomer compressed between the high pressure face of the window and retainer ring will be acceptable. The soft elastomeric seal may take the form of a flat gasket, or a seal ring with O, U, or X cross section." Given its so easy to cut out a circular flat gasket, I think I'll try that first and see how it goes. If there are nuisance leaks, I could upgrade to an O ring by machining the appropriate groove, but I'll try the lazy approach first. These bolt-on window seats are nice in that they allow for later modification. Best, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:56 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi Alec, > > The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the > dome. This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs > who came to visit me. Although of course it should provide sealing at > higher pressure. > > Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested I would need another > seal for low pressure. So, I made the low pressure seal an O ring sitting > in a machined groove in the retaining ring. > > See hastily drawn picture. > > The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in the > picture, which is of course not to scale or anything. I would love to say > it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit. To > start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer. This didn't work as I > couldn't get the O ring to stay in. Then I machined it for a very small O > ring. Couldn't get it in. Eventually, I got a groove and O ring > combination that seemed to work. There is lots of silicone grease on all > surfaces as well. It doesn't leak. > > Regards > James > > > ? > > > > > ? > > On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> Hi James, >> >> That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have >> just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well? >> >> My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the >> window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering >> whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so >> one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O >> ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked >> well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The >> other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it >> with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the >> seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of >> course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. >> >> >> Thanks, >> >> Alec >> >> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via >> Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >>> ?Hi Hank. >>> >>> Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket. The actual edge of the >>> acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium >>> ring. That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like >>> you say. Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway. >>> >>> My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and >>> see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring. Im pretty sure >>> there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler. >>> The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly. >>> >>> I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after >>> welding. You wont have to worry at all then. >>> >>> >>> ? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> James, >>>> I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that >>>> it will not warp at least a small amount. I am not experienced with how >>>> such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give >>>> you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. >>>> Hank-------------------------------------------- >>>> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < >>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >>>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < >>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>>> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM >>>> >>>> Do >>>> you need to go to all that trouble? When I did mine, the >>>> reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and >>>> I just pre-heated it and welded it in. It was so big I >>>> don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't >>>> leak. Just thinking of saving you >>>> what sounds like an expensive job. >>>> On 27 February 2015 at >>>> 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>>> wrote: >>>> James, >>>> >>>> I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A >>>> vertical mill is probably the way to go. I am checking out >>>> another option also. There are machines made to machine >>>> pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. There is a >>>> company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not >>>> sure yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live >>>> only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil >>>> industry. You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are >>>> slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready >>>> Monday. >>>> >>>> Hank -------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >>>> >>>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" >>>> >>>> >>>> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi hank,Sounds like >>>> >>>> it will be a good >>>> modification. How are they going to >>>> >>>> machine the ring? Some sort of vertical >>>> >>>> mill?RegardsJames >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via >>>> >>>> Personal_Submersibles >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Today I >>>> >>>> officially took the plunge and removed the forward >>>> ballast >>>> >>>> tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I >>>> >>>> decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub >>>> >>>> because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for >>>> >>>> lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big >>>> city >>>> >>>> yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should >>>> have >>>> >>>> it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a >>>> pressure >>>> >>>> welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the >>>> big >>>> >>>> city to machine the ring. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Hank >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Dome222.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 53468 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76376 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 10:49:07 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 15:49:07 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: References: <1425043431.37647.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It took me about 5 mins to do the drawing on MS paint! I think you mean something like Stachiw's book, page 524 fig 11.76. Bottom drawing. Probably will work just as well. No machining required! On 27 February 2015 at 15:35, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Thanks, you went to some trouble making that drawing, but it certainly > added clarity. In my case the outside wall of the acrylic is completely > square and there's virtually no gap at all between seat and window, its > literally a few thousandths. I could machine the seat to take an O-ring > groove, as you did with the retaining ring. However, PVHO 2-2.11.1 says "As > primary seals for standard window geometries shown in Figs. 2-2.1 through > 2-2.4, a soft elastomer compressed between the high pressure face of the > window and retainer ring will be acceptable. The soft elastomeric seal may > take the form of a flat gasket, or a seal ring with O, U, or X cross > section." > > Given its so easy to cut out a circular flat gasket, I think I'll try that > first and see how it goes. If there are nuisance leaks, I could upgrade to > an O ring by machining the appropriate groove, but I'll try the lazy > approach first. These bolt-on window seats are nice in that they allow for > later modification. > > > Best, > > Alec > > > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:56 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > >> Hi Alec, >> >> The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the >> dome. This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs >> who came to visit me. Although of course it should provide sealing at >> higher pressure. >> >> Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested I would need another >> seal for low pressure. So, I made the low pressure seal an O ring sitting >> in a machined groove in the retaining ring. >> >> See hastily drawn picture. >> >> The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in >> the picture, which is of course not to scale or anything. I would love to >> say it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit. To >> start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer. This didn't work as I >> couldn't get the O ring to stay in. Then I machined it for a very small O >> ring. Couldn't get it in. Eventually, I got a groove and O ring >> combination that seemed to work. There is lots of silicone grease on all >> surfaces as well. It doesn't leak. >> >> Regards >> James >> >> >> ? >> >> >> >> >> ? >> >> On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >>> Hi James, >>> >>> That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have >>> just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well? >>> >>> My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the >>> window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering >>> whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so >>> one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O >>> ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked >>> well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The >>> other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it >>> with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the >>> seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of >>> course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. >>> >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Alec >>> >>> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via >>> Personal_Submersibles wrote: >>> >>>> ?Hi Hank. >>>> >>>> Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket. The actual edge of the >>>> acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium >>>> ring. That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like >>>> you say. Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway. >>>> >>>> My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and >>>> see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring. Im pretty sure >>>> there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler. >>>> The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly. >>>> >>>> I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after >>>> welding. You wont have to worry at all then. >>>> >>>> >>>> ? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> James, >>>>> I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that >>>>> it will not warp at least a small amount. I am not experienced with how >>>>> such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give >>>>> you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. >>>>> Hank-------------------------------------------- >>>>> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < >>>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >>>>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < >>>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>>>> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM >>>>> >>>>> Do >>>>> you need to go to all that trouble? When I did mine, the >>>>> reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and >>>>> I just pre-heated it and welded it in. It was so big I >>>>> don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't >>>>> leak. Just thinking of saving you >>>>> what sounds like an expensive job. >>>>> On 27 February 2015 at >>>>> 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >>>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> James, >>>>> >>>>> I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A >>>>> vertical mill is probably the way to go. I am checking out >>>>> another option also. There are machines made to machine >>>>> pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. There is a >>>>> company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not >>>>> sure yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live >>>>> only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil >>>>> industry. You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are >>>>> slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready >>>>> Monday. >>>>> >>>>> Hank -------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles >>>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >>>>> >>>>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hi hank,Sounds like >>>>> >>>>> it will be a good >>>>> modification. How are they going to >>>>> >>>>> machine the ring? Some sort of vertical >>>>> >>>>> mill?RegardsJames >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via >>>>> >>>>> Personal_Submersibles >>>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Today I >>>>> >>>>> officially took the plunge and removed the forward >>>>> ballast >>>>> >>>>> tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I >>>>> >>>>> decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub >>>>> >>>>> because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for >>>>> >>>>> lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big >>>>> city >>>>> >>>>> yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should >>>>> have >>>>> >>>>> it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a >>>>> pressure >>>>> >>>>> welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the >>>>> big >>>>> >>>>> city to machine the ring. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hank >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>> >>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>> >>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>> >>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>> >>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76376 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Dome222.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 53468 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 11:34:35 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 11:34:35 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: References: <1425043431.37647.YahooMailBasic@web125402.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Yes, that drawing is exactly what I was trying to describe. On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 10:49 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > It took me about 5 mins to do the drawing on MS paint! > > I think you mean something like Stachiw's book, page 524 fig 11.76. > Bottom drawing. Probably will work just as well. No machining required! > > On 27 February 2015 at 15:35, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> Thanks, you went to some trouble making that drawing, but it certainly >> added clarity. In my case the outside wall of the acrylic is completely >> square and there's virtually no gap at all between seat and window, its >> literally a few thousandths. I could machine the seat to take an O-ring >> groove, as you did with the retaining ring. However, PVHO 2-2.11.1 says "As >> primary seals for standard window geometries shown in Figs. 2-2.1 through >> 2-2.4, a soft elastomer compressed between the high pressure face of the >> window and retainer ring will be acceptable. The soft elastomeric seal may >> take the form of a flat gasket, or a seal ring with O, U, or X cross >> section." >> >> Given its so easy to cut out a circular flat gasket, I think I'll try >> that first and see how it goes. If there are nuisance leaks, I could >> upgrade to an O ring by machining the appropriate groove, but I'll try the >> lazy approach first. These bolt-on window seats are nice in that they allow >> for later modification. >> >> >> Best, >> >> Alec >> >> >> >> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:56 AM, James Frankland via >> Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >>> Hi Alec, >>> >>> The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the >>> dome. This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs >>> who came to visit me. Although of course it should provide sealing at >>> higher pressure. >>> >>> Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested I would need another >>> seal for low pressure. So, I made the low pressure seal an O ring sitting >>> in a machined groove in the retaining ring. >>> >>> See hastily drawn picture. >>> >>> The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in >>> the picture, which is of course not to scale or anything. I would love to >>> say it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit. To >>> start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer. This didn't work as I >>> couldn't get the O ring to stay in. Then I machined it for a very small O >>> ring. Couldn't get it in. Eventually, I got a groove and O ring >>> combination that seemed to work. There is lots of silicone grease on all >>> surfaces as well. It doesn't leak. >>> >>> Regards >>> James >>> >>> >>> ? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ? >>> >>> On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi James, >>>> >>>> That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you >>>> have just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well? >>>> >>>> My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the >>>> window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering >>>> whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so >>>> one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O >>>> ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked >>>> well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The >>>> other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it >>>> with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the >>>> seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of >>>> course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. >>>> >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Alec >>>> >>>> On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via >>>> Personal_Submersibles wrote: >>>> >>>>> ?Hi Hank. >>>>> >>>>> Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket. The actual edge of the >>>>> acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium >>>>> ring. That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like >>>>> you say. Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway. >>>>> >>>>> My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and >>>>> see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring. Im pretty sure >>>>> there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler. >>>>> The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly. >>>>> >>>>> I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after >>>>> welding. You wont have to worry at all then. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >>>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> James, >>>>>> I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine >>>>>> that it will not warp at least a small amount. I am not experienced with >>>>>> how such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may >>>>>> give you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. >>>>>> Hank-------------------------------------------- >>>>>> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < >>>>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >>>>>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < >>>>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>>>>> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM >>>>>> >>>>>> Do >>>>>> you need to go to all that trouble? When I did mine, the >>>>>> reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and >>>>>> I just pre-heated it and welded it in. It was so big I >>>>>> don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't >>>>>> leak. Just thinking of saving you >>>>>> what sounds like an expensive job. >>>>>> On 27 February 2015 at >>>>>> 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < >>>>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> James, >>>>>> >>>>>> I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A >>>>>> vertical mill is probably the way to go. I am checking out >>>>>> another option also. There are machines made to machine >>>>>> pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. There is a >>>>>> company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not >>>>>> sure yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live >>>>>> only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil >>>>>> industry. You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are >>>>>> slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready >>>>>> Monday. >>>>>> >>>>>> Hank -------------------------------------------- >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles >>>>>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome >>>>>> >>>>>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi hank,Sounds like >>>>>> >>>>>> it will be a good >>>>>> modification. How are they going to >>>>>> >>>>>> machine the ring? Some sort of vertical >>>>>> >>>>>> mill?RegardsJames >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via >>>>>> >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles >>>>>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Today I >>>>>> >>>>>> officially took the plunge and removed the forward >>>>>> ballast >>>>>> >>>>>> tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I >>>>>> >>>>>> decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub >>>>>> >>>>>> because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for >>>>>> >>>>>> lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big >>>>>> city >>>>>> >>>>>> yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should >>>>>> have >>>>>> >>>>>> it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a >>>>>> pressure >>>>>> >>>>>> welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the >>>>>> big >>>>>> >>>>>> city to machine the ring. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hank >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>>> >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>>> >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Dome222.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 53468 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76376 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 15:20:22 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 20:20:22 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1338602247.2201532.1425068423427.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> James,in your retaining ring photo, what are the four protrusions with?holes in, on the inside of the ring for?Alan From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2015 4:49 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome It took me about 5 mins to do the drawing on MS paint!?I think you mean something like Stachiw's book, page 524 fig 11.76.? Bottom drawing.? Probably will work just as well.? No machining required! On 27 February 2015 at 15:35, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks, you went to some trouble making that drawing, but it certainly added clarity. In my case the outside wall of the acrylic is completely square and there's virtually no gap at all between seat and window, its literally a few thousandths. I could machine the seat to take an O-ring groove, as you did with the retaining ring. However, PVHO 2-2.11.1 says "As primary seals for standard window geometries shown in Figs. 2-2.1 through 2-2.4, a soft elastomer compressed between the high pressure face of the window and retainer ring will be acceptable. The soft elastomeric seal may take the form of a flat gasket, or a seal ring with O, U, or X cross section."? Given its so easy to cut out a circular flat gasket, I think I'll try that first and see how it goes. If there are nuisance leaks, I could upgrade to an O ring by machining the appropriate groove, but I'll try the lazy approach first. These bolt-on window seats are nice in that they allow for later modification.? Best, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:56 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Alec,?The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the dome.? This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs who came to visit me.? Although of course it?should provide sealing at higher pressure.? ?Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested?I would need another seal for low pressure.? So, I made?the low pressure?seal?an O ring sitting in a machined groove in the retaining ring.?? ?See hastily drawn picture.? ?The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in the picture, which is of course not to scale or anything.?? I would love to say it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit.? To start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer.? This didn't work as?I couldn't get the O ring to stay in.? Then I machined it for a very small O ring.? Couldn't get it in.? Eventually, I got a groove and O ring combination that seemed to work.? There is lots of silicone grease on all surfaces as well.? It doesn't leak.??RegardsJames? ??? ? On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi James, That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well?? My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. Thanks, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Hi Hank.? ?Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket.? The actual edge of the acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium ring.? That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like you say.? Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway.?My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring.? Im pretty sure there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler.? The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly.? ?I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after welding.? You wont have to worry at all then.? ???? On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James, I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that it will not warp at least a small amount.? I am not experienced with how such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ?To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ?Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM ?Do ?you need to go to all that trouble?? When I did mine, the ?reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and ?I just pre-heated it and welded it in.??It was so big I ?don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't ?leak.?Just thinking of saving you ?what sounds like an expensive job. ?On 27 February 2015 at ?11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles ?wrote: ?James, ?I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A ?vertical mill is probably the way to go.? I am checking out ?another option also.? There are machines made to machine ?pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable.? There is a ?company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not ?sure yet what the accuracy is yet.? It is nice that I live ?only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil ?industry.? You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are ?slower.? I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready ?Monday. ?Hank? ? -------------------------------------------- ?On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles ? ?wrote: ??Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ??To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ? ??Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM ??Hi hank,Sounds like ??it will be a good ?modification.? How are they going to ??machine the ring?? Some sort of vertical ??mill?RegardsJames ??On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via ??Personal_Submersibles ??wrote: ??Today I ??officially took the plunge and removed the forward ?ballast ??tank to install my new bow dome.? After much agony I ??decided to make the change.? I am not enjoying the sub ??because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for ??lakes with marginal visibility.? I went to the big ?city ??yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should ?have ??it fitted in a couple of days.? I am bringing in a ?pressure ??welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the ?big ??city to machine the ring. ??Hank ??_______________________________________________ ??Personal_Submersibles mailing list ??Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ??http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ??-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ??_______________________________________________ ??Personal_Submersibles mailing list ??Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ??http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Dome222.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 53468 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76376 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 18:39:19 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Pete Niedermayr via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 15:39:19 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: <1338602247.2201532.1425068423427.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1425080359.28152.YahooMailBasic@web161401.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Hank, What are you going to do for a front ballast tank? Pete -------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Date: Friday, February 27, 2015, 2:20 PM James,in your retaining ring photo, what are the four protrusions with?holes in, on the inside of the ring for?Alan From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2015 4:49 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome It took me about 5 mins to do the drawing on MS paint!?I think you mean something like Stachiw's book, page 524 fig 11.76.? Bottom drawing.? Probably will work just as well.? No machining required! On 27 February 2015 at 15:35, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks, you went to some trouble making that drawing, but it certainly added clarity. In my case the outside wall of the acrylic is completely square and there's virtually no gap at all between seat and window, its literally a few thousandths. I could machine the seat to take an O-ring groove, as you did with the retaining ring. However, PVHO 2-2.11.1 says "As primary seals for standard window geometries shown in Figs. 2-2.1 through 2-2.4, a soft elastomer compressed between the high pressure face of the window and retainer ring will be acceptable. The soft elastomeric seal may take the form of a flat gasket, or a seal ring with O, U, or X cross section."? Given its so easy to cut out a circular flat gasket, I think I'll try that first and see how it goes. If there are nuisance leaks, I could upgrade to an O ring by machining the appropriate groove, but I'll try the lazy approach first. These bolt-on window seats are nice in that they allow for later modification.? Best, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:56 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Alec,?The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the dome.? This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs who came to visit me.? Although of course it?should provide sealing at higher pressure.? ?Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested?I would need another seal for low pressure.? So, I made?the low pressure?seal?an O ring sitting in a machined groove in the retaining ring.?? ?See hastily drawn picture.? ?The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in the picture, which is of course not to scale or anything.?? I would love to say it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit.? To start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer.? This didn't work as?I couldn't get the O ring to stay in.? Then I machined it for a very small O ring.? Couldn't get it in.? Eventually, I got a groove and O ring combination that seemed to work.? There is lots of silicone grease on all surfaces as well.? It doesn't leak.??RegardsJames? ??? ? On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi James, That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well?? My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. Thanks, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Hi Hank.? ?Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket.? The actual edge of the acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium ring.? That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like you say.? Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway.?My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring.? Im pretty sure there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler.? The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly.? ?I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after welding.? You wont have to worry at all then.? ???? On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James, I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that it will not warp at least a small amount.? I am not experienced with how such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ?To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ?Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM ?Do ?you need to go to all that trouble?? When I did mine, the ?reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and ?I just pre-heated it and welded it in.??It was so big I ?don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't ?leak.?Just thinking of saving you ?what sounds like an expensive job. ?On 27 February 2015 at ?11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles ?wrote: ?James, ?I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A ?vertical mill is probably the way to go.? I am checking out ?another option also.? There are machines made to machine ?pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable.? There is a ?company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not ?sure yet what the accuracy is yet.? It is nice that I live ?only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil ?industry.? You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are ?slower.? I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready ?Monday. ?Hank? ? -------------------------------------------- ?On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles ? ?wrote: ??Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ??To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ? ??Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM ??Hi hank,Sounds like ??it will be a good ?modification.? How are they going to ??machine the ring?? Some sort of vertical ??mill?RegardsJames ??On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via ??Personal_Submersibles ??wrote: ??Today I ??officially took the plunge and removed the forward ?ballast ??tank to install my new bow dome.? After much agony I ??decided to make the change.? I am not enjoying the sub ??because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for ??lakes with marginal visibility.? I went to the big ?city ??yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should ?have ??it fitted in a couple of days.? I am bringing in a ?pressure ??welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the ?big ??city to machine the ring. ??Hank ??_______________________________________________ ??Personal_Submersibles mailing list ??Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ??http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ??-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ??_______________________________________________ ??Personal_Submersibles mailing list ??Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ??http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Feb 27 19:47:08 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 16:47:08 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: <1425080359.28152.YahooMailBasic@web161401.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1425084428.98434.YahooMailBasic@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Pete, I have not finalized that part yet. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, Pete Niedermayr via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 6:39 PM Hank, What are you going to do for a front ballast tank? Pete -------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" Date: Friday, February 27, 2015, 2:20 PM James,in your retaining ring photo, what are the four protrusions with?holes in, on the inside of the ring for?Alan ? ? ??? ? From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2015 4:49 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ? ? It took me about 5 mins to do the drawing on MS paint!?I think you mean something like Stachiw's book, page 524 fig 11.76.? Bottom drawing.? Probably will work just as well.? No machining required! On 27 February 2015 at 15:35, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks, you went to some trouble making that drawing, but it certainly added clarity. In my case the outside wall of the acrylic is completely square and there's virtually no gap at all between seat and window, its literally a few thousandths. I could machine the seat to take an O-ring groove, as you did with the retaining ring. However, PVHO 2-2.11.1 says "As primary seals for standard window geometries shown in Figs. 2-2.1 through 2-2.4, a soft elastomer compressed between the high pressure face of the window and retainer ring will be acceptable. The soft elastomeric seal may take the form of a flat gasket, or a seal ring with O, U, or X cross section."? Given its so easy to cut out a circular flat gasket, I think I'll try that first and see how it goes. If there are nuisance leaks, I could upgrade to an O ring by machining the appropriate groove, but I'll try the lazy approach first. These bolt-on window seats are nice in that they allow for later modification.? Best, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:56 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Alec,?The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the dome.? This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs who came to visit me.? Although of course it?should provide sealing at higher pressure.? ?Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested?I would need another seal for low pressure.? So, I made?the low pressure?seal?an O ring sitting in a machined groove in the retaining ring.?? ?See hastily drawn picture.? ?The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in the picture, which is of course not to scale or anything.?? I would love to say it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit.? To start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer.? This didn't work as?I couldn't get the O ring to stay in.? Then I machined it for a very small O ring.? Couldn't get it in.? Eventually, I got a groove and O ring combination that seemed to work.? There is lots of silicone grease on all surfaces as well.? It doesn't leak.??RegardsJames? ??? ? On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi James, That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well?? My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. Thanks, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Hi Hank.? ?Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket.? The actual edge of the acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium ring.? That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like you say.? Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway.?My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring.? Im pretty sure there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler.? The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly.? ?I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after welding.? You wont have to worry at all then.? ???? On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James, I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that it will not warp at least a small amount.? I am not experienced with how such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ?To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ?Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM ?Do ?you need to go to all that trouble?? When I did mine, the ?reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and ?I just pre-heated it and welded it in.??It was so big I ?don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't ?leak.?Just thinking of saving you ?what sounds like an expensive job. ?On 27 February 2015 at ?11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles ?wrote: ?James, ?I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A ?vertical mill is probably the way to go.? I am checking out ?another option also.? There are machines made to machine ?pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable.? There is a ?company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not ?sure yet what the accuracy is yet.? It is nice that I live ?only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil ?industry.? You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are ?slower.? I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready ?Monday. ?Hank? ? -------------------------------------------- ?On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles ? ?wrote: ??Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ??To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ? ??Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM ??Hi hank,Sounds like ??it will be a good ?modification.? How are they going to ??machine the ring?? Some sort of vertical ??mill?RegardsJames ??On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via ??Personal_Submersibles ??wrote: ??Today I ??officially took the plunge and removed the forward ?ballast ??tank to install my new bow dome.? After much agony I ??decided to make the change.? I am not enjoying the sub ??because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for ??lakes with marginal visibility.? I went to the big ?city ??yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should ?have ??it fitted in a couple of days.? I am bringing in a ?pressure ??welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the ?big ??city to machine the ring. ??Hank ??_______________________________________________ ??Personal_Submersibles mailing list ??Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ??http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ??-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ??_______________________________________________ ??Personal_Submersibles mailing list ??Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ??http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? ? -----Inline Attachment Follows----- _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 28 07:17:42 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2015 12:17:42 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: <1338602247.2201532.1425068423427.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1338602247.2201532.1425068423427.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Alan, The four protrusions are the holes that the four mounting bolts attach to. They are inside the hull and attach to dogs on the inside of the reinforcing ring. almost identical to a k boat hatch dog setup. Regards James On Friday, 27 February 2015, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > James, > in your retaining ring photo, what are the four protrusions with > holes in, on the inside of the ring for? > Alan > > ------------------------------ > *From:* James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > > *Sent:* Saturday, February 28, 2015 4:49 AM > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome > > It took me about 5 mins to do the drawing on MS paint! > > I think you mean something like Stachiw's book, page 524 fig 11.76. > Bottom drawing. Probably will work just as well. No machining required! > > > > On 27 February 2015 at 15:35, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > wrote: > > Thanks, you went to some trouble making that drawing, but it certainly > added clarity. In my case the outside wall of the acrylic is completely > square and there's virtually no gap at all between seat and window, its > literally a few thousandths. I could machine the seat to take an O-ring > groove, as you did with the retaining ring. However, PVHO 2-2.11.1 says "As > primary seals for standard window geometries shown in Figs. 2-2.1 through > 2-2.4, a soft elastomer compressed between the high pressure face of the > window and retainer ring will be acceptable. The soft elastomeric seal may > take the form of a flat gasket, or a seal ring with O, U, or X cross > section." > > Given its so easy to cut out a circular flat gasket, I think I'll try that > first and see how it goes. If there are nuisance leaks, I could upgrade to > an O ring by machining the appropriate groove, but I'll try the lazy > approach first. These bolt-on window seats are nice in that they allow for > later modification. > > > Best, > > Alec > > > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:56 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles > > wrote: > > Hi Alec, > > The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the > dome. This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs > who came to visit me. Although of course it should provide sealing at > higher pressure. > > Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested I would need another > seal for low pressure. So, I made the low pressure seal an O ring sitting > in a machined groove in the retaining ring. > > See hastily drawn picture. > > The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in the > picture, which is of course not to scale or anything. I would love to say > it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit. To > start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer. This didn't work as I > couldn't get the O ring to stay in. Then I machined it for a very small O > ring. Couldn't get it in. Eventually, I got a groove and O ring > combination that seemed to work. There is lots of silicone grease on all > surfaces as well. It doesn't leak. > > Regards > James > > > ? > > > > > ? > > On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > wrote: > > Hi James, > > That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have > just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well? > > My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the > window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering > whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so > one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O > ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked > well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The > other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it > with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the > seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of > course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. > > > Thanks, > > Alec > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles > > wrote: > > ?Hi Hank. > > Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket. The actual edge of the acrylic > itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium ring. That > ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like you say. > Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway. > > My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and see > if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring. Im pretty sure there > is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler. The > alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly. > > I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after welding. > You wont have to worry at all then. > > > ? > > > > > On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > wrote: > > > James, > I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that it > will not warp at least a small amount. I am not experienced with how such > heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give you > some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. > Hank-------------------------------------------- > On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > wrote: > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > > Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM > > Do > you need to go to all that trouble? When I did mine, the > reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and > I just pre-heated it and welded it in. It was so big I > don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't > leak. Just thinking of saving you > what sounds like an expensive job. > On 27 February 2015 at > 11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > > wrote: > James, > > I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A > vertical mill is probably the way to go. I am checking out > another option also. There are machines made to machine > pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable. There is a > company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not > sure yet what the accuracy is yet. It is nice that I live > only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil > industry. You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are > slower. I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready > Monday. > > Hank -------------------------------------------- > > On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles > > > wrote: > > > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome > > To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" > > > > Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM > > > > Hi hank,Sounds like > > it will be a good > modification. How are they going to > > machine the ring? Some sort of vertical > > mill?RegardsJames > > > > On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via > > Personal_Submersibles > > > wrote: > > Today I > > officially took the plunge and removed the forward > ballast > > tank to install my new bow dome. After much agony I > > decided to make the change. I am not enjoying the sub > > because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for > > lakes with marginal visibility. I went to the big > city > > yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should > have > > it fitted in a couple of days. I am bringing in a > pressure > > welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the > big > > city to machine the ring. > > > > Hank > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > > > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Dome222.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 53468 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76376 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 28 13:31:32 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2015 18:31:32 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <270642184.417821.1425148292243.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> ThanksAlan From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Sunday, March 1, 2015 1:17 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome Alan,The four protrusions are the holes that the four mounting bolts attach to.? They are inside the hull and attach to dogs on the inside of the reinforcing ring. almost identical to a k boat hatch dog setup.RegardsJames On Friday, 27 February 2015, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James,in your retaining ring photo, what are the four protrusions with?holes in, on the inside of the ring for?Alan From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2015 4:49 AM Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome It took me about 5 mins to do the drawing on MS paint!?I think you mean something like Stachiw's book, page 524 fig 11.76.? Bottom drawing.? Probably will work just as well.? No machining required! On 27 February 2015 at 15:35, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks, you went to some trouble making that drawing, but it certainly added clarity. In my case the outside wall of the acrylic is completely square and there's virtually no gap at all between seat and window, its literally a few thousandths. I could machine the seat to take an O-ring groove, as you did with the retaining ring. However, PVHO 2-2.11.1 says "As primary seals for standard window geometries shown in Figs. 2-2.1 through 2-2.4, a soft elastomer compressed between the high pressure face of the window and retainer ring will be acceptable. The soft elastomeric seal may take the form of a flat gasket, or a seal ring with O, U, or X cross section."? Given its so easy to cut out a circular flat gasket, I think I'll try that first and see how it goes. If there are nuisance leaks, I could upgrade to an O ring by machining the appropriate groove, but I'll try the lazy approach first. These bolt-on window seats are nice in that they allow for later modification.? Best, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 9:56 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Alec,?The epdm gasket was really just to relieve stress on the seat of the dome.? This was with advice from the guy who built the Canary island subs who came to visit me.? Although of course it?should provide sealing at higher pressure.? ?Emile made the dome and mounting ring and suggested?I would need another seal for low pressure.? So, I made?the low pressure?seal?an O ring sitting in a machined groove in the retaining ring.?? ?See hastily drawn picture.? ?The gap where the O ring sits is nowhere near as severe as it looks in the picture, which is of course not to scale or anything.?? I would love to say it was carefully engineered, but im afraid I just winged it a bit.? To start with the O ring groove was just a chamfer.? This didn't work as?I couldn't get the O ring to stay in.? Then I machined it for a very small O ring.? Couldn't get it in.? Eventually, I got a groove and O ring combination that seemed to work.? There is lots of silicone grease on all surfaces as well.? It doesn't leak.??RegardsJames? ??? ? On 27 February 2015 at 14:05, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi James, That's some good looking hardware! Just a question if I may. Do you have just the gasket for making a seal, or is there an O-ring as well?? My project sub has a bow dome seated in an aluminum ring. Currently the window is just sitting on a gasket with no O-ring, but I'm wondering whether to switch to an O ring. The window seat is 90 degrees square, so one possibility would be to chamfer the edge of the acrylic and put an O ring in the angle. That is what I did on Snoopy's hatch dome, it worked well and is a solution that doesn't require any changes to the seat. The other option is to put an O ring at the top of the acrylic and squeeze it with the retaining ring, but that would mean machining a chamfer into the seat, and would require machinery larger than what I have here. Or of course I could do nothing and see if it seals well with just an EPDM gasket. Thanks, Alec On Fri, Feb 27, 2015 at 8:40 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Hi Hank.? ?Yes, agreed, my dome does sit on a gasket.? The actual edge of the acrylic itself sits on a 1mm epdm gasket that sits onto the aluminium ring.? That ring bolts to the main reinforcing ring and has an o ring like you say.? Maybe this does give it a little bit of leeway.?My dome is off at the moment, so I will have a look at the weekend and see if I can see any distortion on the reinforcing ring.? Im pretty sure there is none, or none that is detectable by the naked eye\straight ruler.? The alu ring seems to fis to it perfectly.? ?I suppose the best option is like you say, get it machined after welding.? You wont have to worry at all then.? ???? On 27 February 2015 at 13:23, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: James, I am just assuming it needs to be perfect ? and I can not imagine that it will not warp at least a small amount.? I am not experienced with how such heavy material will react. Your dome sits on a gasket witch may give you some forgiveness. Maybe Emile can comment having done this also. Hank-------------------------------------------- On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ?Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ?To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ?Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 7:28 AM ?Do ?you need to go to all that trouble?? When I did mine, the ?reinforcing ring was milled flat on the seating surface and ?I just pre-heated it and welded it in.??It was so big I ?don't think there was any distortion and it doesn't ?leak.?Just thinking of saving you ?what sounds like an expensive job. ?On 27 February 2015 at ?11:45, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles ?wrote: ?James, ?I am amazed at the equipment some of the big shops have. A ?vertical mill is probably the way to go.? I am checking out ?another option also.? There are machines made to machine ?pipe flanges that clamp on and are portable.? There is a ?company in Calgary that specializes in this. I am just not ?sure yet what the accuracy is yet.? It is nice that I live ?only 3 hr from a big oil town that caters to the oil ?industry.? You can tell that oil is low, and the shops are ?slower.? I ordered the ring on a Friday and it was ready ?Monday. ?Hank? ? -------------------------------------------- ?On Fri, 2/27/15, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles ? ?wrote: ??Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Gamma bow dome ??To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" ? ??Received: Friday, February 27, 2015, 4:08 AM ??Hi hank,Sounds like ??it will be a good ?modification.? How are they going to ??machine the ring?? Some sort of vertical ??mill?RegardsJames ??On Friday, 27 February 2015, hank pronk via ??Personal_Submersibles ??wrote: ??Today I ??officially took the plunge and removed the forward ?ballast ??tank to install my new bow dome.? After much agony I ??decided to make the change.? I am not enjoying the sub ??because the forward window arrangement is not ideal for ??lakes with marginal visibility.? I went to the big ?city ??yesterday and picked up the reinforcing ring and should ?have ??it fitted in a couple of days.? I am bringing in a ?pressure ??welder to weld the ring and then the sub is off to the ?big ??city to machine the ring. ??Hank ??_______________________________________________ ??Personal_Submersibles mailing list ??Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ??http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ??-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ??_______________________________________________ ??Personal_Submersibles mailing list ??Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ??http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?-----Inline Attachment Follows----- ?_______________________________________________ ?Personal_Submersibles mailing list ?Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org ?http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 28 14:32:00 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Steve McQueen via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2015 14:32:00 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 2015 Psub Convention Dates Confirmed! Message-ID: All, the Navy has officially approved our dates/ability to visit and tour the 2015 International Submarine Races a key point of our conference this year so the dates are confirmed! Hold these dates open: June 25,26,27th with June 24th being a meet and greet in the evening. Alec Smyth reminded me that the Washington DC area is full of family friendly activities so we will be also providing information that might allow spouses and family to be more easily entertained than during past conventions. Why not consider turning this into a family vacation? More to come as we can now plan the details. Steve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Feb 28 15:56:13 2015 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2015 12:56:13 -0800 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 2015 Psub Convention Dates Confirmed! Message-ID: <20150228125613.39DDD2EB@m0005310.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: