[PSUBS-MAILIST] Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 50, Issue 19
Marc de Piolenc via Personal_Submersibles
personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Wed Aug 9 21:19:47 EDT 2017
Peltier modules ARE more efficient than resistive heaters because they
are true heat pumps - they don't supply (all) the heat that they emit on
the hot side. In fact, they are more efficient as heaters than as
coolers. That said, using them is a lot more difficult than using
resistors, because they have to be connected on one side to a heat
source and on the other to the area you want heated. In a sub, that
sounds like you need another penetration in your pressure hull, which I
would not be interested in if it were mine.
Marc
On 8/10/2017 8:14 AM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles wrote:
> Hi Alan,
> Resistive heating being about as close as you can get to 100%, I would
> be sceptical about that. I've experimented with Peltier modules for gas
> cooling and they were quite disappointing in performance, although
> wonderfully simple in operation.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
>
> On 10 Aug 2017 8:33 am, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles"
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> Just did some Googling on the Peltier as a heater.
> In an experiment I saw it was more efficient than resistive heating!
> This depends to an extent on the ambient heat differential.
> I would imagine you would need to attach them to the hull & surround
> them
> with an insulating material to stop the metal of the hull radiating back
> the cold or heat produced, & force it to transfer it all to the water.
> Another bunny trail to investigate.
> Cheers Alan
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 10/08/2017, at 9:18 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
>> Mike,
>> the peltier is only 1/4 to 1/3 as efficient as a compressor
>> system, but Cliff
>> & I have very little spare room. They serve as heaters by
>> reversing polarity.
>> I am not sure of their efficiency as heaters compared with
>> resistive coils;
>> probably poor! Cliff would have to cut a hole in his fibreglass
>> outer & dig back
>> the syntactic foam to the pressure hull to get cooling on the
>> reverse side of
>> the peltier or compressor air conditioning unit. Could look sexy
>> if he put some
>> shark gills in it for water ingress.
>> Cliff didn't have a cover on the dome, & that would let a lot of
>> heat in.
>> We had a wet towel on Snoopy last time at Islamorada.
>> Have heard that people like Nuytco use a shore based air
>> conditioner to cool
>> the sub down prior to a dive; but I don't know how long that
>> benefit would
>> last being towed out that distance.
>> Cheers Alan
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On 10/08/2017, at 6:25 AM, peaceroom via Personal_Submersibles
>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>>
>>> Reference,summer submarine cooling. A scaled down version of the
>>> small cooler with ice and DC fan, similar to the one in Sportys,
>>> aviation supplies is what a lot of planes use. Just an
>>> inexpensive idea. Peltier coolers provide very little cooling
>>> versus DC current used. Mike Patterson
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my Samsung device
>>>
>>>
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
>>> Date: 8/9/17 11:46 AM (GMT-05:00)
>>> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> Subject: Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 50, Issue 19
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>> Today's Topics:
>>>
>>> 1. Re: Islamorada Trip Report...
>>> (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles)
>>> 2. Re: Islamorada Trip Report...
>>> (james cottrell via Personal_Submersibles)
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 1
>>> Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2017 08:03:07 -0500
>>> From: Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Islamorada Trip Report...
>>> Message-ID:
>>> <CAK4DN4DuhY87_6v+19RNb-6x2d9fKdaCW1uND2psz=ncVoQ9cg at mail.gmail.com
>>> <mailto:CAK4DN4DuhY87_6v+19RNb-6x2d9fKdaCW1uND2psz=ncVoQ9cg at mail.gmail.com>>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>
>>> Footage from my sub on the trip is limited due to condensation on
>>> viewport. I used Dove soap on the viewport interior prior to
>>> taking off
>>> but because of the humidity , temperature and duration of the
>>> dive, this
>>> treatment did not last and I did not have more soap on board.
>>> The other
>>> issue is I only had two hand towels on board and these became
>>> soaked with
>>> sweat. As such, they were not good for cleaning the condensation
>>> off after
>>> the two hour tow to the dive site. Action items: Have small
>>> bottle of
>>> Dove soap on board and more towels for future long duration dives.
>>>
>>> Yes, I have been reading up on peltier coolers. I have quite a
>>> bit of
>>> battery capacity so this could work. Unfortunately, mounting on
>>> hull won't
>>> work for me as I have syntactic foam under the FRP shell over the
>>> hull so I
>>> don't have a cool surface to mount on. I do have a pair of
>>> plugged off
>>> ports on the bottom of the boat that would give me access to
>>> cooling water
>>> source if I installed a small pump on this circuit. Pushing this
>>> water
>>> through a small fin-fan cooler like you would see on water cooled
>>> motorcycle would help with the temperature some what but not
>>> humidity. At
>>> Islamorada, the average water temperature at the time of the dive
>>> was about
>>> 87F so this would not have helped all that much. A small DC AC
>>> system that
>>> controlled both temperature and humidity would be better.
>>>
>>> On the thruster pneumatic pressure compensation, I was very happy
>>> with how
>>> this worked. I have all four of my thrusters connected to 1/4"
>>> SS tubing
>>> that is manifold into a single pressure reducing/relieving regulator
>>> (thanks Hugh) under the cover just aft of the pilot. I was not
>>> sure if a
>>> single regulator would work or if I would need one for each
>>> thruster but it
>>> looks like one was adequate. I have had two deep dives with the
>>> arrangement, one to 155 ft and one to 100 ft and have had no
>>> issues with
>>> water in the thrusters.
>>>
>>> Best Regards
>>>
>>> Cliff
>>>
>>> On Tue, Aug 8, 2017 at 10:50 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>>>
>>> > Thanks Cliff,
>>> > I presume you shot some footage from your sub & this is the entr?e!
>>> > Nice & clear, you must have been pretty happy down there!
>>> > After you mentioned air conditioning, I looked into peltier
>>> elements &
>>> > air conditioning units. The peltier conditioners have only 25% the
>>> > efficiency
>>> > of a normal compression cycle system, but are really small & by
>>> reversing
>>> > the polarity can act as heaters. A few of those peltier
>>> elements stuck to
>>> > the hull
>>> > with air channelled past them might be the way to go! Not sure what
>>> > batteries you
>>> > are using, but the new battery technologies on the way will
>>> make energy
>>> > expenditure less of an issue!
>>> > Do you have all 4 motors exhausting through one regulator?
>>> Couldn't see
>>> > any
>>> > air coming out of the motor seals so the pressure isn't
>>> building up too
>>> > much
>>> > when exhausting.
>>> > Cheers Alan
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Sent from my iPad
>>> >
>>> > On 9/08/2017, at 8:25 AM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <
>>> > personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Added two quick and dirty Youtube videos from 2017 Psubs
>>> Regatta. The
>>> > first is the 100 ft dive 5.3 miles offshore on Aug 3
>>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHqL49V0lMw
>>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHqL49V0lMw> and the second is a
>>> night
>>> > dive in front of Doug's house
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDBw1ZOdKaI
>>> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDBw1ZOdKaI>.
>>> > Alec is working on a more comprehensive video of the Regatta.
>>> >
>>> > Regards
>>> >
>>> > Cliff
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, Aug 7, 2017 at 4:53 PM, Douglas Suhr via
>>> Personal_Submersibles <
>>> > personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Greetings PSUBS group, Douglas Suhr here to share my take on
>>> the 4-day
>>> >> sub operation we just completed in Islamorada, FL (July 31st,
>>> August
>>> >> 1-3).
>>> >>
>>> >> Wow, what a whirlwind! So July 31st was really an arrival /
>>> setup day
>>> >> with August 1-3 being true operational days. Though it was
>>> unfortunate
>>> >> that Alec wasn't able to make it with Shackleton, we had our hands
>>> >> full with Cliff's R-300. Without Shackleton, we also had
>>> enough time
>>> >> to get Snoopy set up and lowered into the canal for some basic
>>> diving.
>>> >>
>>> >> List of Crew: Dan Lance, Steve McQueen, Cliff Redus, Rick Maxwell,
>>> >> River Dolfi, Mike Patterson, Doug, Sarah, Douglas Suhr.
>>> >>
>>> >> This was my first time meeting Dan Lance, a (retired)
>>> saturation diver
>>> >> and commercial welder. What a pleasure to have him join us on this
>>> >> operation. Dan is modest, but most willing to share his
>>> knowledge and
>>> >> extensive experience with a newbie like me. So pleased to have
>>> chatted
>>> >> with him in the Keys. During the towing of the R-300, Dan
>>> manned the
>>> >> tow line and helped with comms.
>>> >>
>>> >> Steve McQueen and River Dolfi did awesome jobs as our frog men.
>>> >> Filming, attaching / detaching davit and tow lines, etc. they were
>>> >> both in and out of the water quite a bit (especially Steve). I
>>> think
>>> >> River took a little jelly sting for the team. What troopers!
>>> >>
>>> >> Cliff and his assistant Rick are such a joy be around. Rick is
>>> one of
>>> >> the friendliest people you'll ever meet (and even brought a
>>> gift for
>>> >> the group: a watermelon, straight from Texas!). Cliff is always
>>> >> willing to share his expertise (and sub, too) with anyone
>>> who'd like
>>> >> to learn more. I know that between Dan Lance and Cliff, I
>>> learned more
>>> >> than I can remember last week.
>>> >>
>>> >> Mike Patterson, mom, dad and myself were all just providing
>>> whatever
>>> >> kind of "troop support" we could to Cliff and the R-300.
>>> >>
>>> >> River, Steve and Myself got in some dive time on Snoopy in the
>>> canal
>>> >> (which was great), but I think the biggest accomplishment was
>>> getting
>>> >> the R-300 out a ways into the ocean.
>>> >>
>>> >> Our Boston Whaler (a 25' boat with a single 250hp Yamaha) was
>>> able to
>>> >> tow the R-300 out about 5 miles into the ocean (at about 4mph). We
>>> >> were in radio communication with Cliff most of the time,
>>> though we did
>>> >> suffer a few intermittent losses in comms. When we got to a
>>> spot about
>>> >> 100 feet deep, we started to slow down a bit and at that point
>>> the tow
>>> >> line hook (an admittedly cheap thing) let loose(!) so we
>>> decided that
>>> >> we had reached our dive location. We switched from marine
>>> radio to OTS
>>> >> and Cliff started down. Visibility was supurb! As Cliff neared the
>>> >> bottom at 100 ? 110 feet, he was still quite visible from the
>>> Whaler!
>>> >> His 18 foot long R-300 looked to be about 3 inches long, but
>>> wow did
>>> >> it ever stand out from the rest of the sandy bottom. Cliff
>>> spent about
>>> >> an hour "flying" his sub, surfacing, diving and maneuvering about,
>>> >> testing systems and observing the ocean around him. By the
>>> time Cliff
>>> >> surfaced and we towed back to port Antigua, elapsed time stood
>>> at 4.5
>>> >> / 5 hours (estimate). Cliff said that he stayed cool by the water
>>> >> flowing over the sub's dome hatch while in tow. Upon returning
>>> I think
>>> >> we were all ready to take a break, but everyone felt great
>>> >> accomplishment with the mission.
>>> >>
>>> >> A couple of lessons I took away from the tow out: We need
>>> better tow
>>> >> equipment (better line, hardware and maybe a quick release).
>>> Our boat
>>> >> REALLY needs a GPS (still don't have one). Towing into waves
>>> isn't so
>>> >> much a problem, but when towing with the waves, our tow line
>>> needs to
>>> >> be measured so as to sustain the proper distance between tow
>>> vessel
>>> >> and sub (otherwise the sub and boat are constantly slacking
>>> and then
>>> >> jerking, stressing the tow line and making it difficult for
>>> boat and
>>> >> sub to track straight).
>>> >>
>>> >> The devotion of our crew was amazing, even in the heat and the
>>> waves
>>> >> everyone did their jobs. Managing even a small sub operation
>>> like this
>>> >> is more work / effort than meets the eye, that's for sure. At
>>> dinner,
>>> >> one of the main discussions revolved around a support vessel
>>> that can
>>> >> carry a sub or two on board, eliminating the slow, time
>>> consuming tow
>>> >> out to an ocean dive site. Dan Lance shared details on his support
>>> >> vessel project, which is no doubt going to be a dream in terms of
>>> >> logistics. Hopefully when said vessel is ready to sail, Dan
>>> will lend
>>> >> its services to host a diving event! ~ Douglas S.
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> >>
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>>> >
>>> >
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>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 2
>>> Date: Wed, 9 Aug 2017 15:46:22 +0000 (UTC)
>>> From: james cottrell via Personal_Submersibles
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Islamorada Trip Report...
>>> Message-ID: <1907666847.421009.1502293582178 at mail.yahoo.com
>>> <mailto:1907666847.421009.1502293582178 at mail.yahoo.com>>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>
>>> Hi Cliff,
>>> Congrats on your dives. Sub really looks great in those videos.
>>> With regards to an AC solution, one low tech method would be to
>>> blow air across ice in a small cooler. Water ice can be super
>>> cooled with Dry Ice the night before. Dry ice is about - 100 F
>>> and water ice cooled to this temperature should stay cold for
>>> quite some time.
>>> Greg C From: Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 9, 2017 9:05 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Islamorada Trip Report...
>>>
>>> Footage from my sub on the trip is limited due to condensation on
>>> viewport.? I used Dove soap on the viewport interior?prior to
>>> taking off but because of the humidity , temperature and duration
>>> of the dive, this treatment did not last and I did not have more
>>> soap on board.? The other issue is I only had two hand towels on
>>> board and these became soaked with sweat.? As such, they were not
>>> good for cleaning the condensation off?after the two hour tow to
>>> the dive site.? Action items:? Have small bottle of Dove soap on
>>> board and more towels for future long duration dives.?
>>> Yes, I have been reading up on peltier coolers.? I have quite a
>>> bit of battery capacity so this could work.? Unfortunately,
>>> mounting on hull won't work for me as I have syntactic foam under
>>> the FRP shell over the hull so I don't have a cool surface to
>>> mount on.? I do have a pair of plugged off ports on the bottom of
>>> the boat that would give me access to cooling water source if I
>>> installed a small pump on this circuit.? Pushing this water
>>> through a small fin-fan cooler like you would see on?water cooled
>>> motorcycle would help with the temperature some what but
>>> not?humidity.? ?At Islamorada, the average water temperature at
>>> the time of the dive was about 87F so this would not have helped
>>> all that much.? A small DC AC system that controlled both
>>> temperature and humidity would be better.
>>> On the thruster pneumatic pressure compensation, I was very happy
>>> with how this worked.? I have all four of my thrusters connected
>>> to 1/4" SS tubing that is manifold into a single pressure
>>> reducing/relieving regulator (thanks Hugh) ?under the cover just
>>> aft of the pilot.?I was not sure if a single regulator would work
>>> or if I would need one for each thruster but it looks like one
>>> was adequate.? I have had two deep dives with the arrangement,
>>> one to 155 ft and one to 100 ft and have had no issues with water
>>> in the thrusters.
>>> Best Regards
>>> Cliff
>>> On Tue, Aug 8, 2017 at 10:50 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks Cliff,I presume you shot some footage from your sub & this
>>> is the entr?e!Nice & clear, you must have been pretty happy down
>>> there!After you mentioned air conditioning, I looked into peltier
>>> elements &air conditioning units. The peltier conditioners have
>>> only 25% the efficiency?of a normal compression cycle system, but
>>> are really small & by reversingthe polarity can act as heaters. A
>>> few of those peltier elements stuck to the hull?with air
>>> channelled past them might be the way to go! Not sure what
>>> batteries youare using, but the new battery technologies on the
>>> way will make energyexpenditure less of an issue!Do you have all
>>> 4 motors exhausting through one regulator? Couldn't see any?air
>>> coming out of the motor seals so the pressure isn't building up
>>> too muchwhen exhausting.Cheers Alan
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> On 9/08/2017, at 8:25 AM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Added two quick and dirty Youtube videos from 2017 Psubs
>>> Regatta.? The first is the 100 ft dive 5.3 miles offshore on Aug
>>> 3??https://www.youtube.com/ watch?v=sHqL49V0lMw?and the second is
>>> a night dive in front of Doug's house??https://www.youtube.
>>> com/watch?v=KDBw1ZOdKaI.? Alec is working on a more comprehensive
>>> video of the Regatta.
>>> Regards
>>> Cliff
>>> On Mon, Aug 7, 2017 at 4:53 PM, Douglas Suhr via
>>> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Greetings PSUBS group, Douglas Suhr here to share my take on the
>>> 4-day
>>> sub operation we just completed in Islamorada, FL (July 31st, August
>>> 1-3).
>>>
>>> Wow, what a whirlwind! So July 31st was really an arrival / setup day
>>> with August 1-3 being true operational days. Though it was
>>> unfortunate
>>> that Alec wasn't able to make it with Shackleton, we had our hands
>>> full with Cliff's R-300. Without Shackleton, we also had enough time
>>> to get Snoopy set up and lowered into the canal for some basic
>>> diving.
>>>
>>> List of Crew: Dan Lance, Steve McQueen, Cliff Redus, Rick Maxwell,
>>> River Dolfi, Mike Patterson, Doug, Sarah, Douglas Suhr.
>>>
>>> This was my first time meeting Dan Lance, a (retired) saturation
>>> diver
>>> and commercial welder. What a pleasure to have him join us on this
>>> operation. Dan is modest, but most willing to share his knowledge and
>>> extensive experience with a newbie like me. So pleased to have
>>> chatted
>>> with him in the Keys. During the towing of the R-300, Dan manned the
>>> tow line and helped with comms.
>>>
>>> Steve McQueen and River Dolfi did awesome jobs as our frog men.
>>> Filming, attaching / detaching davit and tow lines, etc. they were
>>> both in and out of the water quite a bit (especially Steve). I think
>>> River took a little jelly sting for the team. What troopers!
>>>
>>> Cliff and his assistant Rick are such a joy be around. Rick is one of
>>> the friendliest people you'll ever meet (and even brought a gift for
>>> the group: a watermelon, straight from Texas!). Cliff is always
>>> willing to share his expertise (and sub, too) with anyone who'd like
>>> to learn more. I know that between Dan Lance and Cliff, I learned
>>> more
>>> than I can remember last week.
>>>
>>> Mike Patterson, mom, dad and myself were all just providing whatever
>>> kind of "troop support" we could to Cliff and the R-300.
>>>
>>> River, Steve and Myself got in some dive time on Snoopy in the canal
>>> (which was great), but I think the biggest accomplishment was getting
>>> the R-300 out a ways into the ocean.
>>>
>>> Our Boston Whaler (a 25' boat with a single 250hp Yamaha) was able to
>>> tow the R-300 out about 5 miles into the ocean (at about 4mph). We
>>> were in radio communication with Cliff most of the time, though
>>> we did
>>> suffer a few intermittent losses in comms. When we got to a spot
>>> about
>>> 100 feet deep, we started to slow down a bit and at that point
>>> the tow
>>> line hook (an admittedly cheap thing) let loose(!) so we decided that
>>> we had reached our dive location. We switched from marine radio
>>> to OTS
>>> and Cliff started down. Visibility was supurb! As Cliff neared the
>>> bottom at 100 ? 110 feet, he was still quite visible from the Whaler!
>>> His 18 foot long R-300 looked to be about 3 inches long, but wow did
>>> it ever stand out from the rest of the sandy bottom. Cliff spent
>>> about
>>> an hour "flying" his sub, surfacing, diving and maneuvering about,
>>> testing systems and observing the ocean around him. By the time Cliff
>>> surfaced and we towed back to port Antigua, elapsed time stood at 4.5
>>> / 5 hours (estimate). Cliff said that he stayed cool by the water
>>> flowing over the sub's dome hatch while in tow. Upon returning I
>>> think
>>> we were all ready to take a break, but everyone felt great
>>> accomplishment with the mission.
>>>
>>> A couple of lessons I took away from the tow out: We need better tow
>>> equipment (better line, hardware and maybe a quick release). Our boat
>>> REALLY needs a GPS (still don't have one). Towing into waves isn't so
>>> much a problem, but when towing with the waves, our tow line needs to
>>> be measured so as to sustain the proper distance between tow vessel
>>> and sub (otherwise the sub and boat are constantly slacking and then
>>> jerking, stressing the tow line and making it difficult for boat and
>>> sub to track straight).
>>>
>>> The devotion of our crew was amazing, even in the heat and the waves
>>> everyone did their jobs. Managing even a small sub operation like
>>> this
>>> is more work / effort than meets the eye, that's for sure. At dinner,
>>> one of the main discussions revolved around a support vessel that can
>>> carry a sub or two on board, eliminating the slow, time consuming tow
>>> out to an ocean dive site. Dan Lance shared details on his support
>>> vessel project, which is no doubt going to be a dream in terms of
>>> logistics. Hopefully when said vessel is ready to sail, Dan will lend
>>> its services to host a diving event! ~ Douglas S.
>>>
>>> ______________________________ _________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.or
>>> <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.or> g
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/l istinfo.cgi/personal_submersib les
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ______________________________ _________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
>>>
>>>
>>> ______________________________ _________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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>>> ------------------------------
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>>> End of Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 50, Issue 19
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