[PSUBS-MAILIST] Motors filled with OIL

T Novak via Personal_Submersibles personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Tue Jan 9 14:39:25 EST 2018


Thanks, Alan. 130fsw should work just fine, that's my sub's designated max
depth. Your ambient is really cool.

-----Original Message-----
From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Alan via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Tuesday, January 9, 2018 11:04 AM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motors filled with OIL

Tim,
I didn't go much more than 30ft in it. It was really a concept prototype for
my 1atm. I will dive it again but with my new thrusters & motor controllers.
In theory it could go as deep a diver could on air.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 10/01/2018, at 5:48 AM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> What was the max depth that you tested your ambient sub?
> Tim
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Personal_Submersibles 
> [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
> On Behalf Of Alan via Personal_Submersibles
> Sent: Tuesday, January 9, 2018 2:00 AM
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion 
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motors filled with OIL
> 
> Hi Tarek,
> these were brushed. There are very few inexpensive brushless trolling 
> motors around.
> One or two Chinese trolling motors I know of but generally a lot more 
> expensive.
> There is nothing in the way of electronics inside the brushed motors.
> The main thing you have got to look out for if you want to either oil 
> or air compensate electronics is the big cylindrical electrolytic 
> capacitors. You get these in motor controllers. What pressure they crush
at I am not sure.
> Would be a good experiment to put a bunch of various sized capacitors 
> in a pressure test chamber. You can pot around them with resin to 
> strengthen them.
> I am making my own brushless thrusters from brushless sensored 
> outrunner motors, & oil compensating them.
> Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>>> On 9/01/2018, at 9:04 PM, Tarek Harb via Personal_Submersibles
>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> hi Alan,
>> 
>> Were these Trolling Motors Brushless or not and did they have any 
>> Electronic components inside them?  Can I still Air Compensate them 
>> if they have Electronics inside?
>> Thanks
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Personal_Submersibles
>> [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
>> On Behalf Of via Personal_Submersibles
>> Sent: Monday, January 08, 2018 9:11 PM
>> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>> Subject: Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 55, Issue 36
>> 
>> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to
>>   personal_submersibles at psubs.org
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>> 
>> Today's Topics:
>> 
>>  1. Re: At Home O2 Cleaning Process
>>     (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)  2. Re: Motors filled with 
>> OIL (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
>> 
>> 
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -
>> 
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2018 08:08:31 -0800
>> From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles
>>   <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion"
>>   <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] At Home O2 Cleaning Process
>> Message-ID: <20180108080831.C8ACDB98 at m0117164.ppops.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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>> ------------------------------
>> 
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2018 08:11:11 +1300
>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles 
>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>   <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motors filled with OIL
>> Message-ID: <1F7583C5-3CE9-4096-9981-4636046DEAB6 at yahoo.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset=us-ascii
>> 
>> Tarek,
>> I built a very small dry ambient submarine using inexpensive Chinese 
>> electric trolling motors. I air compensated the motors & hull using 
>> slightly modified octopus regulators.
>> The motors for my next submersible will be oil compensated.
>> My project is under ambient & Alan James on the psub projects page.
>> Let me know if you need any more help.
>> Regards Alan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>>> On 8/01/2018, at 11:53 PM, Tarek Harb via Personal_Submersibles
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi guys,
>>> I am building a Dry Ambient Submarine and I been having trouble 
>>> finding a suitable Motors for it, as I don't want to spend 1000s of 
>>> $ on
>> each motor.
>>> I am sure that the topic has been brought up many times before, but 
>>> I would like to enquire about the best Trolling Motor that can be 
>>> filled with OIL in order to withstand 40 meters Depth of Water.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Appreciate any help in this matter.
>>> 
>>> Tarek
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Personal_Submersibles
>>> [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
>>> On Behalf Of via Personal_Submersibles
>>> Sent: Friday, November 03, 2017 3:28 AM
>>> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>> Subject: Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 53, Issue 1
>>> 
>>> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to  
>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org
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>>> 
>>> Today's Topics:
>>> 
>>> 1. Re: batteries (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)  2. new 
>>> gears (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)  3. Re: new gears (irox 
>>> via Personal_Submersibles)  4. Re: new gears (Alan via
>>> Personal_Submersibles)  5. Re: new gears (hank pronk via
>>> Personal_Submersibles)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> -
>>> -
>>> 
>>> Message: 1
>>> Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2017 18:34:36 +0000
>>> From: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles  
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion  
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries
>>> Message-ID:
>>> 
>>> <CAHpB=UBfz5SrdACR_AWW7JXBOzMMwH-axLH4Z38oqNCQiOmBJw at mail.gmail.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>> 
>>> Hi Rick,
>>> 
>>> Yes, the standard Min kota controller has reverse.  Its just a 
>>> potentiometer on a knob.
>>> 
>>> I went for 24v min kota rip tide 80's.  Wish I had gone for the 
>>> 101's to be honest.
>>> 
>>> I have the aft thruster rigged with the controller at the side of 
>>> the seat, so I set the power and trundle off.  I tend to use the aft 
>>> thruster for surface driving or slow seabed cruising, so its ok 
>>> where it is.  Then I use the side thrusters while submerged for
manouvering.
>>> 
>>> Works ok for me.
>>> 
>>> The pots on the controllers are on a ribbon cable.  I didn't dare 
>>> cut them to extend to anything more useful, although I suspect it would
work.
>>> 
>>> To be honest, that's why I changed the side thrusters to simple 
>>> on\off relays.  The pots were to complicated to move.
>>> 
>>> Got a couple of links here on my site.
>>> regards
>>> James
>>> 
>>> This was how I had it originally.  Was awkward to use side thrusters.
>>> 
>>> http://www.guernseysubmarine.com/Extended_files/Page19613.htm
>>> 
>>> Main power panel.
>>> 
>>> http://www.guernseysubmarine.com/Extended_files/Page19348.htm
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 31/10/2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles 
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> James,
>>>> 
>>>> I didn't realize that the Minn-Kota controllers had a reverse setting?
>>>> Rick
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Oct 31, 2017 at 3:39 AM, James Frankland via 
>>>> Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> I have continuous duty ones at a suitable current rating.  Cant 
>>>>> remember off hand.  But I don't have the reversing because I can 
>>>>> rotate the side motors for reverse.  So I just have 1 relay per motor.
>>>>> Super simple.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Also have the standard minn kota controller on the rear thruster.
>>>>> which allows reverse and speed control.  All 3 items all fit into 
>>>>> one box with a cooling fan for good measure.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sorry, cant recommend anything other than the simple setup I have.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 31 October 2017 at 11:55, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles 
>>>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>> Hi James,
>>>>>> I am using continues duty relays and it takes 4 relays per motor.  
>>>>>> On my vertical thrusters I am using reversing relays (single
>>>>>> relay) but they
>>>>> are
>>>>>> not continues duty, witch is okay.  I want to simplify by using 
>>>>>> reversing relays (continuous duty) on the main motors.  I thought 
>>>>>> maybe you already have that and could recommend what works.
>>>>>> Hank
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 5:14:50 AM MDT, James Frankland via 
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi Hank,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I cant remember off the top of my head now.  I just had a quick 
>>>>>> search and I cant find them.  They are just standard high current 
>>>>>> 24v pots of some sort.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I seem to remember they were similar to yours.  Or some that you 
>>>>>> had
>>>>> used.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> James
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 31 October 2017 at 10:25, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles 
>>>>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi James,
>>>>>>> What type of relays are you using?
>>>>>>> Hank
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 3:10:27 AM MDT, James Frankland 
>>>>>>> via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Hi rick,
>>>>>>> I'm here.  What do you want to know?  I'm using minn Kota rip 
>>>>>>> tide 80's
>>>>> at
>>>>>>> 24v.  2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of 
>>>>>>> batteries in series with both pairs connected to the main 
>>>>>>> terminals.  I have a standard
>>>>> heavy
>>>>>>> switch so I can use each bank separately or both together.  I 
>>>>>>> used heavy tinned marine cable.  Can't remember the thickness.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it 
>>>>>>> seems
>>>>> fine.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had 
>>>>>>> those on the sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to 
>>>>>>> have just on/off
>>>>> relays.
>>>>>>> Much better.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> James
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via 
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Alan
>>>>>>> Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v 
>>>>>>> batteries , 3
>>>>> for
>>>>>>> the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems.
>>>>>>> DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern 
>>>>>>> thruster
>>>>> off
>>>>>>> one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running
>>>>> Minn-Kotas.
>>>>>>> I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the 
>>>>>>> Minn-Kotas
>>>>> in
>>>>>>> his.
>>>>>>> Rick
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles 
>>>>>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Rick,
>>>>>>> I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there 
>>>>>>> two battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod?
>>>>>>> What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 
>>>>>>> thrusters off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect 
>>>>>>> both pods in
>>>>> parallel.
>>>>>>> If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off 
>>>>>>> each battery pod, than you would be if you were using one.
>>>>>>> I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use?
>>>>>>> Cheers Alan
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via 
>>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the 
>>>>>>>> power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and 
>>>>>>>> was wondering if
>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by 
>>>>>>>> Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries.
>>>>>>>> I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and 
>>>>>>>> they
>>>>> are
>>>>>>>> 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity.
>>>>>>>> My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side 
>>>>>>>> at a
>>>>> time
>>>>>>>> and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all 
>>>>>>>> three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all 
>>>>>>>> three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired 
>>>>>>>> for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong 
>>>>>>>> current.
>>>>>>>> I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank 
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>> though
>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be 
>>>>>>>> about a
>>>>>>>> 16.6
>>>>>>>> amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the 
>>>>>>>> thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and 
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time.
>>>>>>>> If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps 
>>>>>>>> from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would 
>>>>>>>> deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries 
>>>>>>>> due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire 
>>>>>>>> be sufficient from battery source to bus
>>>>> bar
>>>>>>>> as
>>>>>>>> long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... 
>>>>>>>> since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, 
>>>>>>>> can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than 
>>>>>>>> the 125 amps I have on my boat?
>>>>>>>> I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch 
>>>>>>>> on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at 
>>>>>>>> a time if can.
>>>>>>>> Comments appreciated.
>>>>>>>> Rick
>>>>>>>> ______________________________ _________________ 
>>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.
>>>>>>>> org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ 
>>>>>>>> submersibles
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> ______________________________ _________________ 
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.
>>>>>>> org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ 
>>>>>>> submersibles
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list 
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org 
>>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list 
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org 
>>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list 
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org 
>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list 
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org 
>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org 
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ------------------------------
>>> 
>>> Message: 2
>>> Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 18:30:48 +0000 (UTC)
>>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] new gears
>>> Message-ID: <110503463.1580898.1509647448063 at mail.yahoo.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>> 
>>> Hi Ian,The gears you made for me arrived, and they are amazing! ?I 
>>> had no idea the fine detail capability. ?The timing is perfect also, 
>>> as I have just finished the gripper and need the wrist gears to 
>>> complete the connection. ?I might have it put together today for a 
>>> test.Thank you againHank
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>>> 
>>> ------------------------------
>>> 
>>> Message: 3
>>> Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2017 12:06:16 -0700 (GMT-07:00)
>>> From: irox via Personal_Submersibles 
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] new gears
>>> Message-ID:
>>>  <220196530.10316.1509649576216 at wamui-mouse.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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>>> ------------------------------
>>> 
>>> Message: 4
>>> Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 08:26:09 +1300
>>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles 
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] new gears
>>> Message-ID: <845E2172-3DE9-4641-A154-5C76DAB1C3A5 at yahoo.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>> 
>>> Well done Ian.
>>> I have posted this before. It is of 3d propeller testing done here in 
>>> Auckland.
>>> Their preference in the end was polycarbonate!
>>> 
>>> http://www.3ders.org/articles/20160302-wooden-3d-printed-boat-prop-ma
>>> k ers-pu t-filaments-to-the-test-with-surprising-results.html
>>> Cheers Alan
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>>>> On 3/11/2017, at 8:06 AM, irox via Personal_Submersibles
>>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Great!  Glad they got there safely.
>>>> 
>>>> Let me know if they work.  If so I'll print up a slightly higher 
>>>> quality
>>> set (probably a couple, for spares and destructive testing).  I'll 
>>> also look into printing a set in nylon.
>>>> 
>>>> You're most welcome.  Thanks for all the videos.
>>>> 
>>>> Cheers!
>>>> Ian.
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>>>> Sent: Nov 2, 2017 11:30 AM
>>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] new gears
>>>> 
>>>> Hi Ian,
>>>> The gears you made for me arrived, and they are amazing!  I had no 
>>>> idea
>>> the fine detail capability.  The timing is perfect also, as I have 
>>> just finished the gripper and need the wrist gears to complete the 
>>> connection.  I might have it put together today for a test.
>>>> Thank you again
>>>> Hank
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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>>> 
>>> ------------------------------
>>> 
>>> Message: 5
>>> Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 01:27:47 +0000 (UTC)
>>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> To: irox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] new gears
>>> Message-ID: <1390402376.1802262.1509672467596 at mail.yahoo.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>> 
>>> Ian,The gears seem pretty tough, and I am sure they will stand up due 
>>> ?to the thickness. ?They machine nicely also, I was worried when I 
>>> put the gear in the lathe chuck, but is was fine. ?I machined the 
>>> bore out so it would slide nicely. ?Pitty I don't have the wrist 
>>> drive motor yet
>> ;-( ?Hank
>>>  On Thursday, November 2, 2017, 1:06:29 PM MDT, irox via 
>>> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> #yiv3031387229 #yiv3031387229 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3031387229 Great!?
>>> Glad they got there safely.
>>> 
>>> Let me know if they work.? If so I'll print up a slightly higher 
>>> quality set (probably a couple, for spares and destructive testing).?
>>> I'll also look into printing a set in nylon.
>>> 
>>> You're most welcome.? Thanks for all the videos.
>>> 
>>> Cheers!
>>> ?Ian.
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>>> Sent: Nov 2, 2017 11:30 AM
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] new gears
>>> 
>>> Hi Ian,The gears you made for me arrived, and they are amazing! ?I 
>>> had no idea the fine detail capability. ?The timing is perfect also, 
>>> as I have just finished the gripper and need the wrist gears to 
>>> complete the connection. ?I might have it put together today for a 
>>> test.Thank you againHank 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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>>> 
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>> Subject: Digest Footer
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