Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Launch Retrieval Transport

Vance, Yes, expense, complexity and ease of use, are all concerns. The inflatable stability collar is pretty neat too...a take on the Apollo flotation systems.

This in fact, isn't a bad backup to have (along with lift bags for recovery) in case you get caught out in a squall...a real possibility here in summer.

Your post here is making me think about the simplest possible solution. A utility trailer vs a specialized one, and bite the bullet at the Marina lift...plenty to be found that's for sure.

Joe

From: vbra676539@aol.com
Reply-To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Launch Retrieval Transport
Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 12:01:28 -0500

I like the LARP that the Makai Range folks cooked up for long range towing, but it is labor intensive, and as expensive as a boat. Great idea for getting out there, though. The real issue is that it takes two or three divers, and a compressor on board to operate. Plus, to all intents and purposes, it is a tethered, unpowered wet sub, and will need just as much care in design and operation as the submersible itself.

As for launch ramps, South Florida, where Joe and I live, is notorious for short ramps with steep drops behind them. Fifty feet of wire might not be a viable answer for us. For those with access to in-and-out dry storage facilities, then a forklift will do the job handily, and might not cost too much if the marina folks are amenable.

Joe and I have talked a bit about surface stability and towability (is that a word?). It might behoove small owners to think in terms of towing, rather than toting. The Nekton design allowed very fast towing, but is pretty roley poley on the surface. (They will, in fact, roll the conning tower into the water under extreme circumstances). However, if the boat tows solidly on the surface at 4 knots, for instance, and you cooked up some kind of inflatable collar (modified inflatable boat, for instance) then you could just drag the sub out to the site, then get the collar attached or inflated or whatever and climb on board at your leisure. Once inside, you'd do the predives, bang the hatch down and have your surface crew unlash the splash guard and cut you loose. Then give them a wave and away you go.

I'm betting it won't be that easy, but it sounds good, doesn't it?

George Kittredge used a small Zodiac tied to the conning tower of his K-350s with a battered old life jacket lashed in between it and the sub as a bumper, and it worked a treat, at least in Penobscot Bay.

Mind you, I think a truck inner tube inflated around your conning tower would perform the same function, and be smaller and cheaper to boot. You could even inflate and deflate the thing from inside, if you were clever during construction, and that would give you a splash guard, some extra flotation, a stabilizing force against roll and wallow--and a pretty nice place to sit while you're contemplating that shiny blue sky which you're about to trade in for the briny deep. That's more or less what I'll be doing. It's homely, but dirt simple, and you can carry replacements for ten bucks apiece. Beat that for homemade.

Vance

-----Original Message-----
From: joeperkel@hotmail.com
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Sent: Sat, 4 Nov 2006 10:31 AM
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Launch Retrieval Transport

I would like to open a discussion for the group to brainstorm a common problem.

In discussions with several members recently, the issue of trailer launching a 2 ton deep draft submersible is weighing a bit on my mind. The image of backing the thing in far enough to "get stuck" and still not float free, or worse...launching the vehicle as well, has real potential.

One member has mentioned to me recently, that as little as 12" decreased draft, would really make a tremendous difference. Saddle tanks alone, may not be enough to do the job.

So...some folks in Hawaii, came up with the LRT barge........

http://www.photolib.noaa.gov/nurp/nur07523.htm

A rather ingenious. but impractical solution for psubbers as it requires diver support, and fully submersible would require increased complexity.

However, it did prompt me to think of these little guys...........

http://www.springsdock.com/images/springs/SpringsNewPontoonBoat_M.jpg

These are available on the used market in various states, but our interest would be the floats, and possibly the deck. But, putting a two ton submersible on this deck would make it unstable, so my thoughts are to...reverse the deck (under slung)... cut flood ports in the bottoms, and attach flotation topside...essentially turning these pontoons into MBT's. Blowing to be accomplished by battery powered centrifugal blowers.

This could be potentially used only for launching and retrieval in the calm waters of the ramp area, then reload it onto the trailer and tow the sub conventionally.

Here are the problems that I can foresee here, and would like discussion on improvements or otherwise unforeseen circumstances.

1) Width limited to 102" for legal towing without permits.

2) Width limit may limit usable space between pontoons in the described configuration.

3) Road towing stability

Sometimes the simplest solutions elude you, so I'd like to see what the group can come up with here.

Joe

************************************************************************ ************************************************************************ ************************************************************************ The personal submersibles mailing list complies with the US Federal CAN-SPAM Act of 2003. Your email address appears in our database because either you, or someone you know, requested you receive messages from our organization. If you want to be removed from this mailing list simply click on the link below or send a blank email message to: removeme-personal_submersibles@psubs.org Removal of your email address from this mailing list occurs by an automated process and should be complete within five minutes of our server receiving your request. PSUBS.ORG PO Box 311 Weare, NH 03281 603-529-1100 ************************************************************************ ************************************************************************ **************************! **********************************************

Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more.