From: "Smyth, Alec" <Alec.Smyth@compuware.com>
Reply-To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Launch Retrieval Transport
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 19:16:50 -0500
Believe it or not I can't find a photo of the extended trailer tongue.
But it's extremely simple. The trailer has a longitudinal square tube
running almost it's entire length. It's strong, probably 4" square and
0.25" thick walls. The square tube is integral to the trailer. Inside
that is a slightly smaller one, and inside that a third. All are 0.25"
walled, strong enough that you can apply some serious towing power
without any fear of bending it, even when extended. So two of the three
tubes slide freely. There are a couple of holes drilled through all
three tubes, to take large pins (0.5" diameter) that prevent the loose
tubes from pulling out. To extend the tongue, you pull the pins, chock
the wheels, and drive the car forward. It does take some back and forth
until you line up the holes again to reinsert the pins, but nothing
major. You should have seen the support team by the end of the
convention, they had it down like a pit crew. I've painted the pull-out
tubes red when they have gone too far, so the driver essentially pulls
them out until red paint is spotted.
It's something like this, except much longer and with two tubes one
inside the other:
http://shop.easternmarine.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=catalog.prodInfo&prod
uctID=5268&categoryID=226
The trailer has a flat aluminum deck, on which I've bolted two long
pieces of plastic square bars which are machined so their surfaces slant
inward. They help guide the sub into the center of the trailer deck and
hold it there. There is also a forward stop, placed so that when the
mechanical grabber on the sub rests against it, the sub is balanced
properly fore and aft. So the trailer deck is "closed" on three sides.
With this arrangement, I get into the sub on land and someone backs the
trailer down the ramp. When the sub floats, I motor off with the
thrusters. For recovering the sub, I motor over the trailer deck until
the mechanical claw touches the forward stop. The K250 front viewport is
perfectly located to see when that happens. The truck pulls the trailer
up the ramp very slowly, with me following by using thrusters until the
trailer takes the sub's weight. This technique I'm using now is a slight
improvement over what I did at the convention, which was to attach a
strap to the bow before moving the trailer up the ramp. Now I launch and
retrieve without either pilot nor crew getting wet. My next enhancement
is going to be painting a line on the deck to help guide me to the front
stop in low visibility.
Both Mark Ragan and Dan H use trailer tongues, but the difference is
that theirs are lightweight, while mine is very heavily built. I'm not
sure which approach is better, all three seem to work just fine.
I do have this on video, so if anyone wants to see it I can just take a
still frame from that.
cheers,
Alec
________________________________
From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org] On Behalf Of Nomdae Plume
Sent: Monday, November 06, 2006 5:52 PM
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Launch Retrieval Transport
Ray:
Is there somewhere we can see photos of this?
-- NP
________________________________
From: Ray Keefer <psubs2001@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Launch Retrieval Transport
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 12:50:49 -0800 (PST)
>Hi,
>
>The best launch and retrieval method that I saw at the
>2006 PSUBS Convention was Alec Smyth's telescoping
>tounge on his trailer.
>
>Yes a cable can be used to back a trailer into the
>water. That is until the trailer hits a bump or rock.
>With a trailer tounge the tow vehicle can push the
>trailer further out when gravity fails you.
>
>For retrieval, once the trailer is out in the water,
>either method works well.
>
>Regards,
>Ray
>
>
>
>
>
>--- Nomdae Plume <nomdae@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>---------------------------------
>
>Hey Joe:
>
>Pat Regan had an interresting solution to the problem:
>He attached a 50 foot cable to his trailer and was
>able to keep his van high on the launch ramp while
>moving his sub into deeper water. You can see this in
>action at:
>
>http://www.vulcaniasubmarine.com/TESTING%20THE%20NAUTILUS%20MINISUB.htm
>
>The draft on my sub is going to be less than three
>feet when surfaced, so I'm not too concerned at this
>point.
>
>-- NP
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
>From: "Joseph Perkel" <joeperkel@hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Launch Retrieval Transport
>Date: Sat, 04 Nov 2006 15:31:31 +0000
>
>I would like to open a discussion for the group to
>brainstorm a common problem.
>
>In discussions with several members recently, the
>issue of trailer launching a 2 ton deep draft
>submersible is weighing a bit on my mind. The image of
>backing the thing in far enough to "get stuck" and
>still not float free, or worse...launching the vehicle
>as well, has real potential.
>
>One member has mentioned to me recently, that as
>little as 12" decreased draft, would really make a
>tremendous difference. Saddle tanks alone, may not be
>enough to do the job.
>
>So...some folks in Hawaii, came up with the LRT
>barge........
>
>http://www.photolib.noaa.gov/nurp/nur07523.htm
>
>A rather ingenious. but impractical solution for
>psubbers as it requires diver support, and fully
>submersible would require increased complexity.
>
>However, it did prompt me to think of these little
>guys...........
>
>http://www.springsdock.com/images/springs/SpringsNewPontoonBoat_M.jpg
>
>
>These are available on the used market in various
>states, but our interest would be the floats, and
>possibly the deck. But, putting a two ton submersible
>on this deck would make it unstable, so my thoughts
>are to...reverse the deck (under slung)... cut flood
>ports in the bottoms, and attach flotation
>topside...essentially turning these pontoons into
>MBT's. Blowing to be accomplished by battery powered
>centrifugal blowers.
>
>This could be potentially used only for launching and
>retrieval in the calm waters of the ramp area, then
>reload it onto the trailer and tow the sub
>conventionally.
>
>Here are the problems that I can foresee here, and
>would like discussion on improvements or otherwise
>unforeseen circumstances.
>
>1) Width limited to 102" for legal towing without
>permits.
>
>2) Width limit may limit usable space between pontoons
>in the described configuration.
>
>3) Road towing stability
>
>Sometimes the simplest solutions elude you, so I'd
>like to see what the group can come up with here.
>
>Joe
>
>
>
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