RE: GUNS was Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PSUB Fatalities...View Ports...Shatterproof

["Rob Teed" <robteed@netzero.net>]

This happens alot??? Give me a break...So some people
 shouldn't have guns...99.8% of gun owners never shoot
 anyone....How many people do you know who have been
 killed as a result of an auto accident???
Go to the NRA website and read the reports of people who
 have protected themselfs and family everyday!!!
Rob Teed

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> [mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org]On Behalf Of Karl & Shirin
> Fuller
> Sent: Monday, March 13, 2000 3:27 PM
> To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> Subject: Re: GUNS was Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PSUB Fatalities...View
> Ports...Shatterproof
>
>
> To Ray, bring on the P-SUBS not the flame !
>
> It's 1am, hot and you ain't sleeping so good, it's been a hard day at the
> office, o subs sold this month, the news on the TV was all bad.
> To make it worse, someone's making a noise down stairs...... down stairs
> !!!!!! Something falls over, has to be an intruder. Heart pounding, you
> slide out of bed, reach for the Colt, nobody is going to mess
> with me or my
> stuff !
> Your years of training cut in now like natural instinct. Silently
> you round
> the corner, gun raised and ready, some bodies words echoing in your head
> "shoot or be shot " Dam ! Just bumped the family wall hanging
> pictures.....
> More noise from downstairs, the intruder startled ! A brief
> shadow movement
> to the left and a creaking floorboard to the right ! Two intruders....bead
> drawn on the noise.... suddenly you realise you are back lit by a window,
> are a sitting  target ! Sweat breaks out on your brow, something
> smashes to
> the
> ground to the left, you swing round as the shadow moves again to
> the right,
> raising an arm.... only the first letter of the words 'Dad it's me' reach
> your ears before they are drowned out by the bast of sound form your gun.
> Time stands still and the split second silence is broken by the thud of a
> body falling to the ground and broken once again by the scream of
> the noise
> to the left and once again broken by the scream of the wife behind you and
> once again broken by the scream inside your own heart as you realise the
> blood running down the stairs is that of your own son........ Never, ever
> will you be the same again. Over and over, over the years, you
> ask yourself,
> how did we ever get in this mess..........( This guy obviously needs some
> counselling from Big Dave !)
>
> This happens a lot, we know it.
> I don't hate guns ( and I have shot on one of your ranges in America, and
> kicked arse !), but I do hate that too many people are dying and
> somebody's
> got to help the broken boy's father above to get rid of unneeded guns.
> Otherwise, it seems to me, the paranoia is heading America for
> another civil
> war, and we know where that led us the last time, to the creation of the
> first mini-sub ! (and better race relations, two big pluses !)
> Jokes aside, somebody has got to reduce guns first, like in
> Ireland and that
> takes more guts than a lot of us have got.
> I agree with you, education has a huge part to play and it begins in the
> home and doesn't start
> on a web site promoting paranoid anti-government sentiments ( not
> the P-SUB
> site !)
> If I have stirred some emotions, I meant to :-)
> From the land down under,
> Karl.
> --.Original Message -----
> From: Ray Keefer <Ray.Keefer@ebay.sun.com>
> ..To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> Sent: 14 March 2000 07:36
> Subject: Re: GUNS was Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PSUB Fatalities...View
> Ports...Shatterproof
>
>
> > Hi Carsten,
> >
> > You really hit a hot button. Expect a lot of flame.
> >
> > I am an avid gun owner. Guns are my number one hobby.
> >
> > > Date: Sat, 11 Mar 2000 20:25:54 +0100
> > > From: MerlinSub@t-online.de (Carsten Standfuß)
> > > X-Accept-Language: de
> > > MIME-Version: 1.0
> > > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> > > Subject: GUNS was Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PSUB Fatalities...View
> > Ports...Shatterproof
> > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> > > X-Sender: 320000596261-0001@t-dialin.net
> > >
> > > Some Statistic:
> > >
> > > 32436 Americans died in 1997 by guns.
> > > In the Korea-war 33651 americans died.
> > >
> > > In 1996 in Newzealand 2 people were killed with guns,
> > > in Japan 15,  in Great Britain 30 in
> > > Germany 213 (what a shame..) but in America 9390 ..
> > >
> >
> > How about cars? Hospitals? Ladders? These things hurt, kill, and maime
> > more people each year then guns. Guns are currently the boogy men of
> > our media and government. Much like the USSR was in the 80's. The Civil
> > Rights in the 60's and 70's. Nuclear war in the 50's. The hype from our
> > media and President are way out of proportion for the problem. Why do
> > you here about a shooting that occurs way across the country when the
> > stabbing next door doesn't even get mention in the local paper. Well
> > could be that any and all gun events need reporting for "some" reason.
> >
> > > In 1996 also 1134 americans died by there own guns
> > > during accident, many of them childrens.
> >
> > Accidental guns deaths have been declining since the 1930's. There would
> be
> > even fewer accidents if safe gun advoidance, like the NRA Eddie Eagle,
> > program (Stop, Don't Touch, Leave the Area, Tell an Adult) was taught in
> > schools. However our Government, School System, and HCI is so anti-gun
> that
> > they would rather not teach the kids anything useful. They
> teach guns are
> evil
> > so when a kid finds one all they have to go on is what they see in the
> movies.
> >
> > >
> > > If I found in my house during nighttime a thief -
> > > I will go in bed and phone the insurance company
> > > next day.
> >
> > Ok. But what if you were a female. Is robbing the only thing on this
> thief's
> > mind? Wouldn't your jewelry be stored in a jewelry box in the bedroom?
> >
> > > The thief knowes that normaly nobody
> > > in germany has a gun - so he normaly has also no
> > > gun. Nobody shoot somebody. If you hold a gun
> > > without a licence for each, without a gunpowder paper,
> > > without a tresor, and good reasons for the licence
> > > you get in jail.
> >
> > If you get caught with a gun that usually adds years to your jail time
> here.
> > At least in theory. Our Government usually plea bargins away the extra
> jail
> > time for an easy conviction. Then once in prison you usually get out
> before
> > serving you whole term to make way for the people convicted
> because of the
> > "war on drugs".
> >
> > > And automatic or machinery guns totaly break
> > > the anti-war-rules. If they catch you the put you
> > > in jail and destroy the key..
> >
> > Full automatic weapons are illegal in many states. In California only
> military,
> > law enforcement and Hollywood is allowed to have fully
> automatic weapons.
> > Normal, lawabiding citizens are denied.
> >
> > In the states that do allow for such ownership there are servere
> requirement
> > and restrictions on ownership of fully automatic weapons. Why? The only
> cases
> > where fully automatic weapons were used in the commision of a
> crime since
> > the 1934 guns acts was by a policeman and two bank robbers.
> >
> >
> > >
> > > And if you a tourist in USA and your car is stopped by a
> > > police car during routine inspection and you did not no the
> > > rules - the shoot you down during the moment you put your
> > > hands into your jacket to grap your driverlicence..
> >
> > Same for citizens. In fact police can just claim that they thought your
> > wallet was a gun and get a way with killing you.
> >
> > >
> > > mmmhh.. nice country...
> >
> > Come visit. I'll take out to a range you will see first hand what a gun
> > is. Not the fake tripe you see in the movies or on TV. You will
> see it for
> > real. You will be very impressed with how careful and friendly
> > guns owners are. I have a few rules:
> >
> > 1. Treat every gun as if it is loaded.
> > 2. Never point at anything you don't want to destroy.
> > 3. Always look to see if it is loaded and still obey rules 1 and 2.
> >
> > >
> > > Sorry no way to test the domes on that way here !-)
> >
> > There is. Take a 7mm steel rod and shape the end into a cone.
> Get a large
> > sledge hammer. Pound the rod into the dome. Use a bigger hammer for more
> > force.
> >
> > Wsny something more scientific and repeatable. Create something like a
> > guiloteen. Except replace the blade with some kind of pointy rod and
> weight.
> > Lay the dome below and drop the weighted point onto it. The
> height of the
> drop
> > will determine the force of impact.
> >
> > Then subject the dome to pressure equivelant to depth and see what
> happens.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ray
> >
> > >
> > > Carsten.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "D. Blake" schrieb:
> > > >
> > > >  Length of barrell?  Grains of powder?  Weight and type of
> bullet ie.
> FMJ,
> > > > softpoint, hollowpoint, wadcutter?
> > > > I've shot .38s from an airweight into a 55-gallon burn
> barrel at 25 or
> so
> > > > feet, and they failed to penetrate.  There was even a pronounced
> audible lag
> > > > in time between the sound of the round going off and the
> impact of the
> > > > bullet.  9mm have a little more velocity, but thats about
> it.  Put it
> to a
> > > > real test!  I suggest you use my Rem. model 700 in .375
> H&H.  You can
> even
> > > > back off a couple of football fields.  One shot, one kill.
> > > > Big Dave
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Paul Suds <paul_suds@hotmail.com>
> > > > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> > > > Date: Thursday, March 09, 2000 9:09 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PSUB Fatalities...View
> Ports...Shatterproof
> > > >
> > > > > How does this sound, I can take my canopy, properly framed,
> > > > >and shoot an aerage .38 caliber or 9mm NATO round from 25
> feet at it.
> After
> > > > >one round no hole, after two rounds no hole, maybe after
> three rounds
> in
> > > > the
> > > > >same location, I may have some penetration. ..
> > > > >Suds
> > > > >______________________________________________________
> > > > >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
> > > > >
> >
> >
>
>
>

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