[PSUBS-MAILIST] concrete

Jim Rudholm jimrudholm at gmail.com
Mon Apr 14 13:43:17 EDT 2014


 Here are a few photos of my party barge, 26' x 8', built in 1968.  Also
some photos of  Martin Iron's Fibersteel mold and a hull in West
Sacramento, CA.  I had returned from two years with the Navy in Japan and
had picked up several cargo parachutes at a surplus store. These made for
an interesting  air inflated building, they were treated with a plastic
preservative coating, but the UV eventually deteriorated the nylon.

https://plus.google.com/photos/110939032764686627267/albums/5294994060907444593?banner=pwa

JimR




On Mon, Apr 14, 2014 at 7:21 AM, Jim Rudholm <jimrudholm at gmail.com> wrote:

> Plenty of photos at:
> concretesubmarine.com
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 14, 2014 at 6:27 AM, Marc de Piolenc <piolenc at archivale.com>wrote:
>
>> Fascinating. I think that counts as water pollution in Europe...
>>
>> Marc
>>
>> On 4/14/2014 6:52 PM, Joe Perkel wrote:
>>
>>> Marc,
>>>
>>> Strictly from my foggy memory, but I believe it was scuttled.
>>>
>>> Joe
>>>
>>> Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad <http://overview.mail.yahoo.com?.src=iOS>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> *From: * Marc de Piolenc <piolenc at archivale.com>;
>>> *To: * <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>;
>>> *Subject: * Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] concrete
>>> *Sent: * Mon, Apr 14, 2014 3:30:48 AM
>>>
>>> Really - it sank? Mind you, it did have walls 6 inches thick and very
>>> little freeboard. Any lives lost?
>>>
>>> Marc
>>>
>>> On 4/13/2014 10:35 PM, Joe Perkel wrote:
>>>  > It seems to me that with reduced cost materials there is a tendency to
>>>  > go big and unwieldy.
>>>  > Wasn't that the case with that one fellows concrete sub yacht? It's on
>>>  > the bottom of a lake somewhere if I recall.
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  > Joe
>>>  >
>>>  > Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad <http://overview.mail.yahoo.
>>> com?.src=iOS>
>>>
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  > ------------------------------------------------------------
>>> ------------
>>>  > *From: * Sean T. Stevenson <cast55 at telus.net <javascript:return>>;
>>>  > *To: * Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>>  > <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <javascript:return>>;
>>>  > *Subject: * Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] concrete
>>>  > *Sent: * Sun, Apr 13, 2014 6:16:35 AM
>>>  >
>>>  > I ran that same 6' diameter 4" shell, but using an ultra
>>> high-performace
>>>  > concrete with no aggregate, but with steel fiber reinforcement.
>>>  Working
>>>  > pressure came out to more than 1700 m.  That said, while the
>>> compressive
>>>  > strength of this stuff is 160 MPa, the tensile is only 8 MPa, so you
>>>  > absolutely have to avoid putting this stuff in tension.  Sphere may
>>> not
>>>  > be an issue, but a cylindrical hull would probably require some sort
>>> of
>>>  > pretensioned reinforcement.  Results:
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  > On 2014-04-12 21:52, Marc de Piolenc wrote:
>>>  >> I had forgotten about the lubricant/plasticizer properties of fly
>>> ash.
>>>  >>
>>>  >> Marc
>>>  >>
>>>  >> On 4/13/2014 10:55 AM, hank pronk wrote:
>>>  >>> Marc,
>>>  >>> We don't get segregation at all, when pumping it we fill the wall
>>> and
>>>  >>> then let it flow, I call it "ride the wave"
>>>  >>> Also pumping the concrete helps hold the concrete together, it stays
>>>  >>> in a cylinder shape until it hits the wave. We must use fly ash
>>>  >>> because the aggregate and sand is washed so well there are no fines
>>>  >>> left.  The jagged sand won't flow through the hose.  Fly ash is like
>>>  >>> little ball bearings and makes it flow through the hose.  These are
>>>  >>> the things that make me think a mold  is the way to go.  Four inches
>>>  >>> wall thickness would be a breeze for this mix.
>>>  >>> That makes sense that the rock is a cheap filler.  I would still use
>>>  >>> the pea gravel mix, I have made a test panel and I drove my bob-cat
>>>  >>> over a 2in thick 4by4 panel with no breakage.  I know, very
>>>  >>> scientific .lol
>>>  >>>
>>>  >>> Hank
>>>  >>> --------------------------------------------
>>>  >>> On Sat, 4/12/14, Marc de Piolenc <piolenc at archivale.com
>>> <javascript:return>> wrote:
>>>  >>>
>>>  >>>  Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] concrete
>>>  >>>  To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org <javascript:return>
>>>  >>>  Received: Saturday, April 12, 2014, 10:40 PM
>>>  >>>
>>>  >>>  Actually, all else being equal, using
>>>  >>>  only fine aggregate (sand) will give a stronger mix. Coarse
>>>  >>>  aggregate is needed mainly to make the mix affordable - as
>>>  >>>  bulk filler, in other words - and also for decorative effect
>>>  >>>  in some applications where the fresh concrete is brushed to
>>>  >>>  show off the aggregate.
>>>  >>>
>>>  >>>  You have to be careful, in very high-strength applications,
>>>  >>>  to make sure that the coarse aggregate is chemically inert
>>>  >>>  with respect to the cement matrix. Some siliceous aggregate
>>>  >>>  will weaken the concrete in the long term by reacting slowly
>>>  >>>  with the matrix long after cure.
>>>  >>>
>>>  >>>  Confusingly, very fine silica incorporated in the form of
>>>  >>>  fly ash, rice husk ash or silica fume can give a
>>>  >>>  super-HIGH-strength mix. The reason for the effect is that
>>>  >>>  the very fine silica reacts with the alkali formed DURING
>>>  >>>  cure and actually strengthens the cement matrix.
>>>  >>>  Unfortunately, much of the fly-ash and volcanic ash cement
>>>  >>>  on the market is too coarsely ground to harness this
>>>  >>>  effect.
>>>  >>>
>>>  >>>  Best,
>>>  >>>  Marc de Piolenc
>>>  >>>  Ferrocement freak
>>>
>>>  >
>>>  >
>>>  >
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>>>  >
>>>
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>> --
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>> Polymath weblog: http://www.archivale.com/weblog
>> Translations (ProZ profile): http://www.proz.com/profile/639380
>> Translations (BeWords profile): http://www.bewords.com/Marc-dePiolenc
>> Ducted fans: http://massflow.archivale.com/
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