[PSUBS-MAILIST] Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 16, Issue 36

James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Mon Oct 27 06:45:57 EDT 2014


Hi Robert.

If you are seriously considering building a K boat, you'll definitely need
the plans.   There are an awful lot of parts you'll need and it will depend
on how you wish to do each bit.  There's a lot of choice with motors,
valves, pipework etc.

As a rough idea, I think my boat has cost £30,000.  That includes machines
I needed to buy, plus t I spared no expense and made quite a lot of
modifications.

Hope that helps
Regards
James

On 27 October 2014 06:07, Bob Travis via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> I would recommend that you purchase the plans. Each K boat is going to be
> a little different and I think it would be extremely difficult to build one
> with just a parts list.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 26, 2014, at 7:40 PM, roberto alvarez via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> need i buy the plans to have a bill of materials for the k 350? i need
> know the material list to quote, some one have it' ?
>
> 2014-10-26 12:11 GMT-07:00 via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>:
>
>> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to
>>         personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>>
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>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>    1. Re: (no subject) (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
>>    2. Re: (no subject) (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
>>    3. Re: Water jets (Graham Bayliss via Personal_Submersibles)
>>    4. Re: cart last days (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
>>    5. Re: Water jets (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 08:15:18 -0700
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> Message-ID:
>>         <1414336518.83309.YahooMailBasic at web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>
>>
>> Graham,
>> A jet ski jet is gigantic for a psub.  Jet ski's have 50hp and more, the
>> one I have is from a 750 cc two stroke engine.  Mine has a 3 inch nozzle at
>> least maybe more.  Jets are very bad for maneuvering, they have no grip in
>> the water like a prop.  Yes fast ferries use them but they are owned by
>> governments, check the fuel tank size lol.  I would do some reading about
>> jet viruses props.  Don't get me wrong, I love the idea, and it is a fun
>> idea, I just don't think it will do what you imagine it will.  I hope I am
>> wrong.
>> Hank --------------------------------------------
>> On Sun, 10/26/14, Graham Bayliss via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>>  Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>>  To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>  Received: Sunday, October 26, 2014, 11:06 AM
>>
>>
>>  Hi Hank
>>
>>
>>  I agree a jet drive is the
>>  way to go did you not think that a jet ski drive
>>  was to small and would only drive a small
>>  craft. I intend to build a larger
>>  jet drive
>>  and compress the water. This will be easy and add power to
>>  the
>>  system the jet drive from a jet ski
>>  would not drive a sub but I am certain I
>>  can
>>  overcome the problems by building a larger jet drive and a
>>  compressor.
>>  Thank you for your input and I
>>  will keep you informed as the project un
>>  folds.
>>
>>  Graham
>>
>>
>>  -----Original
>>  Message-----
>>  From: Personal_Submersibles
>>  [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
>>  On Behalf Of hank pronk via
>>  Personal_Submersibles
>>  Sent: 26 October 2014
>>  12:42
>>  To: Personal Submersibles General
>>  Discussion
>>  Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no
>>  subject)
>>
>>
>>  Graham,
>>  In the world of marine
>>  jet drive it is well known that jet drive takes two
>>  times the horse power to do the same job.? Jet
>>  drive is well suited to a
>>  craft that needs a
>>  shallow draft.? I think you will find it very
>>  complicated
>>  to control and it will be very
>>  inefficient. I have been down this road, I
>>  love the concept but abandoned it.? If you go
>>  forward may I suggest you
>>  start with a jet
>>  drive.? It is not a simple part to replicate.? The
>>  impeller
>>  tolerances are critical.? I have a
>>  jet unit on the shelf I could donate to
>>  your
>>  project.? The jet is from a jet ski. I would consider a
>>  single rear
>>  motor on a full gimbal.
>>  Hank
>>  --------------------------------------------
>>  On Sun, 10/26/14, Graham Bayliss via
>>  Personal_Submersibles
>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>  wrote:
>>
>>   Subject:
>>  [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>>   To:
>>  "'Personal Submersibles General
>>  Discussion'"
>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>   Received: Sunday, October 26, 2014, 7:39 AM
>>
>>   #yiv9417249292
>>   #yiv9417249292 --
>>  ?
>>  ? _filtered #yiv9417249292 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5
>>  4 6 3 2 4;}
>>  ? _filtered #yiv9417249292
>>  {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15
>>   5 2 2 2
>>  4 3 2 4;}
>>   #yiv9417249292
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 p.yiv9417249292MsoNormal, #yiv9417249292
>>  li.yiv9417249292MsoNormal, #yiv9417249292?
>>  div.yiv9417249292MsoNormal
>>   ???
>>  {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}
>>   #yiv9417249292 a:link, #yiv9417249292
>>   span.yiv9417249292MsoHyperlink
>>   ???
>>  {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 a:visited, #yiv9417249292
>>  span.yiv9417249292MsoHyperlinkFollowed
>>   ???
>>  {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 span.yiv9417249292EmailStyle17
>>   ??? {color:#1F497D;}
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 .yiv9417249292MsoChpDefault
>>
>>  ??? {}
>>  ? _filtered #yiv9417249292
>>  {margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt? 72.0pt;}
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 div.yiv9417249292WordSection1
>>   ??? {}
>>   #yiv9417249292
>>  ?Hi? ?I am near the end of my build? of my k350 and
>>  have
>>  started to look at new designs I am?
>>  interested in building a flyer sub and
>>  have
>>  come up with a? design which will include a vectored motor
>>  drive this
>>  will? enable my flyer to hover
>>  and stop where ever I want. I have? designed
>>  a motor unit which will drive a fan type
>>  propeller? as an intake this will
>>  force
>>  water to the rear of the unit
>>   ?where it is
>>  compressed ?then it is forced into ducting? which will
>>  take?
>>  the water to four nozzles on the side
>>  of? the craft. The nozzles are able to
>>  turn
>>  three hundred and? sixty degrees? both side are
>>  independent of one
>>  another so? rolls will
>>  be achievable. The reason for a vectored motor is
>>  you only need one motor source and one power
>>  pack this will? ease the
>>  maintenance and
>>  increase the enjoyment of using? your sub. I am
>>  interested
>>  in the clubs thought of this
>>  kind? of design. ?Graham
>>   ?
>>   -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>   Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>   Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>   http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 08:16:37 -0700
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> Message-ID:
>>         <1414336597.16836.YahooMailBasic at web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>
>>
>> Graham,
>> message me at hankpronk at live.ca  I am happy to send you some stuff.
>> Hank--------------------------------------------
>> On Sun, 10/26/14, Graham Bayliss via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>>  Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>>  To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>  Received: Sunday, October 26, 2014, 11:06 AM
>>
>>
>>  Hi Hank
>>
>>
>>  I agree a jet drive is the
>>  way to go did you not think that a jet ski drive
>>  was to small and would only drive a small
>>  craft. I intend to build a larger
>>  jet drive
>>  and compress the water. This will be easy and add power to
>>  the
>>  system the jet drive from a jet ski
>>  would not drive a sub but I am certain I
>>  can
>>  overcome the problems by building a larger jet drive and a
>>  compressor.
>>  Thank you for your input and I
>>  will keep you informed as the project un
>>  folds.
>>
>>  Graham
>>
>>
>>  -----Original
>>  Message-----
>>  From: Personal_Submersibles
>>  [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
>>  On Behalf Of hank pronk via
>>  Personal_Submersibles
>>  Sent: 26 October 2014
>>  12:42
>>  To: Personal Submersibles General
>>  Discussion
>>  Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no
>>  subject)
>>
>>
>>  Graham,
>>  In the world of marine
>>  jet drive it is well known that jet drive takes two
>>  times the horse power to do the same job.? Jet
>>  drive is well suited to a
>>  craft that needs a
>>  shallow draft.? I think you will find it very
>>  complicated
>>  to control and it will be very
>>  inefficient. I have been down this road, I
>>  love the concept but abandoned it.? If you go
>>  forward may I suggest you
>>  start with a jet
>>  drive.? It is not a simple part to replicate.? The
>>  impeller
>>  tolerances are critical.? I have a
>>  jet unit on the shelf I could donate to
>>  your
>>  project.? The jet is from a jet ski. I would consider a
>>  single rear
>>  motor on a full gimbal.
>>  Hank
>>  --------------------------------------------
>>  On Sun, 10/26/14, Graham Bayliss via
>>  Personal_Submersibles
>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>  wrote:
>>
>>   Subject:
>>  [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>>   To:
>>  "'Personal Submersibles General
>>  Discussion'"
>>  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>   Received: Sunday, October 26, 2014, 7:39 AM
>>
>>   #yiv9417249292
>>   #yiv9417249292 --
>>  ?
>>  ? _filtered #yiv9417249292 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5
>>  4 6 3 2 4;}
>>  ? _filtered #yiv9417249292
>>  {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15
>>   5 2 2 2
>>  4 3 2 4;}
>>   #yiv9417249292
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 p.yiv9417249292MsoNormal, #yiv9417249292
>>  li.yiv9417249292MsoNormal, #yiv9417249292?
>>  div.yiv9417249292MsoNormal
>>   ???
>>  {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}
>>   #yiv9417249292 a:link, #yiv9417249292
>>   span.yiv9417249292MsoHyperlink
>>   ???
>>  {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 a:visited, #yiv9417249292
>>  span.yiv9417249292MsoHyperlinkFollowed
>>   ???
>>  {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 span.yiv9417249292EmailStyle17
>>   ??? {color:#1F497D;}
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 .yiv9417249292MsoChpDefault
>>
>>  ??? {}
>>  ? _filtered #yiv9417249292
>>  {margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt? 72.0pt;}
>>
>>  #yiv9417249292 div.yiv9417249292WordSection1
>>   ??? {}
>>   #yiv9417249292
>>  ?Hi? ?I am near the end of my build? of my k350 and
>>  have
>>  started to look at new designs I am?
>>  interested in building a flyer sub and
>>  have
>>  come up with a? design which will include a vectored motor
>>  drive this
>>  will? enable my flyer to hover
>>  and stop where ever I want. I have? designed
>>  a motor unit which will drive a fan type
>>  propeller? as an intake this will
>>  force
>>  water to the rear of the unit
>>   ?where it is
>>  compressed ?then it is forced into ducting? which will
>>  take?
>>  the water to four nozzles on the side
>>  of? the craft. The nozzles are able to
>>  turn
>>  three hundred and? sixty degrees? both side are
>>  independent of one
>>  another so? rolls will
>>  be achievable. The reason for a vectored motor is
>>  you only need one motor source and one power
>>  pack this will? ease the
>>  maintenance and
>>  increase the enjoyment of using? your sub. I am
>>  interested
>>  in the clubs thought of this
>>  kind? of design. ?Graham
>>   ?
>>   -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>   Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>   Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>   http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 15:16:38 -0000
>> From: Graham Bayliss via Personal_Submersibles
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'"
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Water jets
>> Message-ID: <001801cff12f$d6f91a00$84eb4e00$@net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> Hi Marc de Piolenc
>>
>> I agree whole heartedly there is nothing inefficient about a water jet
>> just
>> point it one way and add power and you will end up going the other way as
>> they say a=b= push. I will carry on with this and have a working craft at
>> the end to enjoy.
>>
>> Graham
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:
>> personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
>> On Behalf Of Marc de Piolenc via Personal_Submersibles
>> Sent: 26 October 2014 14:11
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Water jets
>>
>> There is nothing inherently inefficient about waterjets. There are
>> commercial fast ferries using them and getting very good thrust per
>> horsepower - better than any supercavitating propeller could do at the
>> same
>> speed, certainly.
>>
>> Lousy design will of course produce poor results, and jets are much less
>> amenable to rule-of-thumb construction than open propellers. But whether
>> it
>> is "well known" or not, good design will produce good results.
>>
>> Marc de Piolenc
>>
>> On 10/26/2014 8:41 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote:
>> >
>> > Graham,
>> > In the world of marine jet drive it is well known that jet drive takes
>> two
>> times the horse power to do the same job.  Jet drive is well suited to a
>> craft that needs a shallow draft.  I think you will find it very
>> complicated
>> to control and it will be very inefficient. I have been down this road, I
>> love the concept but abandoned it.  If you go forward may I suggest you
>> start with a jet drive.  It is not a simple part to replicate.  The
>> impeller
>> tolerances are critical.  I have a jet unit on the shelf I could donate to
>> your project.  The jet is from a jet ski. I would consider a single rear
>> motor on a full gimbal.
>> > Hank --------------------------------------------
>> > On Sun, 10/26/14, Graham Bayliss via Personal_Submersibles
>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> >
>> >   Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> >   To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'"
>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> >   Received: Sunday, October 26, 2014, 7:39 AM
>> >
>> >   #yiv9417249292
>> >   #yiv9417249292 --
>> >
>> >    _filtered #yiv9417249292 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
>> >    _filtered #yiv9417249292 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15
>> >   5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
>> >   #yiv9417249292
>> >   #yiv9417249292 p.yiv9417249292MsoNormal, #yiv9417249292
>> >   li.yiv9417249292MsoNormal, #yiv9417249292
>> >   div.yiv9417249292MsoNormal
>> >       {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}
>> >   #yiv9417249292 a:link, #yiv9417249292
>> >   span.yiv9417249292MsoHyperlink
>> >       {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}
>> >   #yiv9417249292 a:visited, #yiv9417249292
>> >   span.yiv9417249292MsoHyperlinkFollowed
>> >       {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}
>> >   #yiv9417249292 span.yiv9417249292EmailStyle17
>> >       {color:#1F497D;}
>> >   #yiv9417249292 .yiv9417249292MsoChpDefault
>> >       {}
>> >    _filtered #yiv9417249292 {margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt
>> >   72.0pt;}
>> >   #yiv9417249292 div.yiv9417249292WordSection1
>> >       {}
>> >   #yiv9417249292  Hi   I am near the end of my build
>> >   of my k350 and have started to look at new designs I am
>> >   interested in building a flyer sub and have come up with a
>> >   design which will include a vectored motor drive this will
>> >   enable my flyer to hover and stop where ever I want. I have
>> >   designed a motor unit which will drive a fan type propeller
>> >   as an intake this will force water to the rear of the unit
>> >    where it is compressed  then it is forced into ducting
>> >   which will take  the water to four nozzles on the side of
>> >   the craft. The nozzles are able to turn three hundred and
>> >   sixty degrees  both side are independent of one another so
>> >   rolls will be achievable. The reason for a vectored motor is
>> >   you only need one motor source and one power pack this will
>> >   ease the maintenance and increase the enjoyment of using
>> >   your sub. I am interested in the clubs thought of this kind
>> >   of design.  Graham
>> >
>> >   -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>> >
>> >   _______________________________________________
>> >   Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> >   Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> >   http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Archivale catalog: http://www.archivale.com/catalog Polymath weblog:
>> http://www.archivale.com/weblog Translations (ProZ profile):
>> http://www.proz.com/profile/639380
>> Translations (BeWords profile): http://www.bewords.com/Marc-dePiolenc
>> Ducted fans: http://massflow.archivale.com/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 10:25:40 -0700
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] cart last days
>> Message-ID:
>>         <1414344340.13872.YahooMailBasic at web125403.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>>
>>
>> Alec,
>> This project will take some time, and some experimenting.  I am using a
>> 23cubic inch hyd motor to drive the cart.  I am not sure that will do it,
>> so I am building it to take any motor.
>> Hank--------------------------------------------
>> On Sun, 10/26/14, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>>  Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] cart last days
>>  To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>  Received: Sunday, October 26, 2014, 9:07 AM
>>
>>  What
>>  impresses me is that to most of us this would be a six month
>>  or year-long project, but I would not be surprised to see
>>  pictures in a day or two!
>>  Alec
>>  On Sat, Oct 25, 2014 at
>>  6:21 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>  wrote:
>>  I just
>>  pushed my launch cart into the shop for the last time.?
>>  Tomorrow it will be reborn.? The cart is getting a new rear
>>  axel that steers via hyd cylinder, the front is getting a
>>  1/2 ton chev differential with a hydraulic motor to drive
>>  it.? The cart then gets two dual chamber pontoons that act
>>  as ballast tanks.? On top of one pontoon will be a 6 1/2 hp
>>  Honda motor that drives a hyd pump to power and steer the
>>  cart,? as well as a 24v alternator to charge my sub
>>  batteries.? I will be able to drive the cart with the sub
>>  on it down the boat ramp or beach or whatever into the
>>  water.? The cart will stay anchored in the water, until I
>>  am ready to put the sub on and drive back to my trailer.
>>  SWEET
>>
>>  Hank
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>
>>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>
>>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>
>>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>
>>  -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 5
>> Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 15:11:26 -0400
>> From: Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Water jets
>> Message-ID:
>>         <CABECYQ6vJo=
>> ek1rwvwV2hi06emVXV1eRYa65qqR_uEoMwMkFDA at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>
>> I don't think water jets are necessarily inefficient, but if there is
>> considerable piping around of the water before it exits through the jets,
>> that's what I was referring to. However, even that was not meant as
>> criticism, it is just a normal trade-off. It is surely less efficient than
>> a conventional direct-coupled prop, but you also get
>> entanglement-resistance and maneuverability.
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 10:11 AM, Marc de Piolenc via
>> Personal_Submersibles
>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>> > There is nothing inherently inefficient about waterjets. There are
>> > commercial fast ferries using them and getting very good thrust per
>> > horsepower - better than any supercavitating propeller could do at the
>> same
>> > speed, certainly.
>> >
>> > Lousy design will of course produce poor results, and jets are much less
>> > amenable to rule-of-thumb construction than open propellers. But
>> whether it
>> > is "well known" or not, good design will produce good results.
>> >
>> > Marc de Piolenc
>> >
>> > On 10/26/2014 8:41 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Graham,
>> >> In the world of marine jet drive it is well known that jet drive takes
>> >> two times the horse power to do the same job.  Jet drive is well
>> suited to
>> >> a craft that needs a shallow draft.  I think you will find it very
>> >> complicated to control and it will be very inefficient. I have been
>> down
>> >> this road, I love the concept but abandoned it.  If you go forward may
>> I
>> >> suggest you start with a jet drive.  It is not a simple part to
>> replicate.
>> >> The impeller tolerances are critical.  I have a jet unit on the shelf I
>> >> could donate to your project.  The jet is from a jet ski. I would
>> consider
>> >> a single rear motor on a full gimbal.
>> >> Hank --------------------------------------------
>> >> On Sun, 10/26/14, Graham Bayliss via Personal_Submersibles <
>> >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>   Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> >>   To: "'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'" <
>> >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> >>   Received: Sunday, October 26, 2014, 7:39 AM
>> >>
>> >>   #yiv9417249292
>> >>   #yiv9417249292 --
>> >>
>> >>    _filtered #yiv9417249292 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
>> >>    _filtered #yiv9417249292 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15
>> >>   5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
>> >>   #yiv9417249292
>> >>   #yiv9417249292 p.yiv9417249292MsoNormal, #yiv9417249292
>> >>   li.yiv9417249292MsoNormal, #yiv9417249292
>> >>   div.yiv9417249292MsoNormal
>> >>         {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}
>> >>   #yiv9417249292 a:link, #yiv9417249292
>> >>   span.yiv9417249292MsoHyperlink
>> >>         {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}
>> >>   #yiv9417249292 a:visited, #yiv9417249292
>> >>   span.yiv9417249292MsoHyperlinkFollowed
>> >>         {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}
>> >>   #yiv9417249292 span.yiv9417249292EmailStyle17
>> >>         {color:#1F497D;}
>> >>   #yiv9417249292 .yiv9417249292MsoChpDefault
>> >>         {}
>> >>    _filtered #yiv9417249292 {margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt
>> >>   72.0pt;}
>> >>   #yiv9417249292 div.yiv9417249292WordSection1
>> >>         {}
>> >>   #yiv9417249292  Hi   I am near the end of my build
>> >>   of my k350 and have started to look at new designs I am
>> >>   interested in building a flyer sub and have come up with a
>> >>   design which will include a vectored motor drive this will
>> >>   enable my flyer to hover and stop where ever I want. I have
>> >>   designed a motor unit which will drive a fan type propeller
>> >>   as an intake this will force water to the rear of the unit
>> >>    where it is compressed  then it is forced into ducting
>> >>   which will take  the water to four nozzles on the side of
>> >>   the craft. The nozzles are able to turn three hundred and
>> >>   sixty degrees  both side are independent of one another so
>> >>   rolls will be achievable. The reason for a vectored motor is
>> >>   you only need one motor source and one power pack this will
>> >>   ease the maintenance and increase the enjoyment of using
>> >>   your sub. I am interested in the clubs thought of this kind
>> >>   of design.  Graham
>> >>
>> >>   -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>> >>
>> >>   _______________________________________________
>> >>   Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> >>   Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> >>   http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> >>
>> >>
>> > --
>> > Archivale catalog: http://www.archivale.com/catalog
>> > Polymath weblog: http://www.archivale.com/weblog
>> > Translations (ProZ profile): http://www.proz.com/profile/639380
>> > Translations (BeWords profile): http://www.bewords.com/Marc-dePiolenc
>> > Ducted fans: http://massflow.archivale.com/
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> >
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>> ------------------------------
>>
>> End of Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 16, Issue 36
>> *****************************************************
>>
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